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By Katrina Wilcox on 9/28/2005 11:45AM  
Special BRAD BLOG / Velvet Revolution coverage
of the Sep 24-26 Rally in D.C.
Guest blogged by Katrina Wilcox

Well ... we are back home - working on the last few articles about our trip to DC. While I try to make coherent sense out of the notes I took, here's the last interview. Stan Goff's essay The Butterfly Effect --- Katrina and Occupation helped me to see that we are all living under occupation.

1. What caused you to become an activist and when was this?

My first activism was being thrown out of high school in my junior year for refusing to cut my hair. Not a huge issue, and ironically I ended up in the army not long after. Then a lot of things interrupted that so-called activism - which was unfocused rebelliousness - like the military, chemical dependency, a psychotic marriage, stuff like that.

Seriously, however, the military was a direct, if lengthy, route into political work for me. My experience as a kind of globetrotting tool for imperialism was my education and informs everything I think and do now. How could it not? I often wonder if I had not been in the military if I might have ended up being a libertarian or a drug dealer or something.

I had doubts and role conflicts all through my career, but that is really no different then anyone else who is partially awake. There is a tendency to be drawn into notions of the military as more unique than it is. People who work for IBM or Citibank or Food Lion probably experience role conflicts, too. Our notions of basic morality are in deep conflict with the necessities of our daily lives in a patriarchal and imperialist society.

But Haiti was the straw that finally broke the proverbial camel's back for me. I was in such close and sustained contact with the population during that invasion, without a little artificial American refuge, that I couldn't find any respite from the contradictions. When I came back, I sought out political people and began my more conscious activism then.

2. What compelled you to write The Butterfly Effect - Katrina and Occupation?

Love and rage, to steal a phrase. I was already so busy I could hardly see straight, and I was telling myself that I would not get drawn into writing anything about this --- that plenty of people would see the system clearly with the mask ripped off as it was. Then I was hypnotically watching the horror unfold on television, when I saw a young African American woman with a child around the same age as my grandson --- maybe two and a half --- and the child was draped over his mother's shoulder lethargically, and she was saying that he hadn't had any water for two days... he was growing more and more lifeless with each passing hour. She was raging and she was loving that child, and found myself unable to escape from the nightmare she was living, unable to separate her from me, her child from my grandchild. So I wrote the piece as an alternative to finding the first lowlife white politician I could identify and running over him with my car.

3. What message would you like every American to hear at this crucial time?

I don't know about every American. But if we are talking about those who had the capacity for outrage, then I want to say that this has been going on all along. That's what the Katrina piece was about. People all around us have been living in hell for a long time, and we are all living in the last stage of imperialism - an age of extermination through debt, disease, poverty, neglect, and war. I want to say that we can not change it through individual effort, and that the time for half-measures is already past. We are living in an age of emergency, and what is at stake is what life will mean for people like that child, like my grandson, like all our children. I want to say that we cannot change what needs changing in time, unless we are willing to go beyond playing by the dominant class's rules. We don't need elections now.

We need much much more. We need general strikes, street blockades, and popular assemblies, but we are not mentally prepared for that yet. I want to say that the clock is ticking, and it has already run out for many. Katrina showed us our future if we don't fight back.

4. Given the chance to address Congress and the administration, what would you say to them?

Go straight to hell. Do not pass go. Do not collect $200. With only a handful of exceptions.

5. What do you consider to be the most important problem facing America at this point? Do you have a solution?

There is no hierarchy of problems. They are all interwoven with each other. Capitalism, patriarchy, national oppression. I would be very suspicious of anyone who claimed to have THE solution. Sounds pretty messiah-like to me.

6. Bringing about change in the government through letter writing, signing petitions, and making phone calls is not working. Do you have any thoughts or ideas on ways to accomplish real change?

Learn, teach, organize, and struggle. There is no one size fits all. I am pretty confident, however, of the importance of erasing illusions about electoralism. Elections are only one tiny aspect of struggle, but they have turned into a vortex that sucks up all our resources. I am also confident that the social movements have to get stronger, and that they have to wean themselves from the Internal Revenue Service's non-profit system, which has pluralized us and set us against each other. The other things that remain critically important, and require very hard work, are stopping the imperial occupation, fighting racism and national oppression at home, and struggling against patriarchy.

7. One such idea is for everyone that attends this weekend's rally to stay in Washington until the government is forced to change and bring the troops home, etc. Do you think that idea would work?

It happened. Over a quarter million showed, and it was very important. One thing that happened there were repeated references to the links between Iraq and Katrina. Now we have to go back to our communities and lock in our gains. One thing I would say is that we cannot let Katrina be the flavor-of-the-day issue. We have to unite with those who were most affected, and by that I mean African America. White progressives should feel obliged to do two things: accept local, Black leadership and organize around the priorities set by that leadership. And share resources. Making statements of solidarity is not even close to enough. Organizations like Community Labor United in and around New Orleans deserve our undivided attention and support.

8. Do you have any thoughts or ideas on ways to get the corporate media to get our message out?

The corporate media gets involved when there are fractures within the ruling class. We don't control that dynamic, but we can exploit it. When new questions are raised, as they were around Katrina, we have to be prepared to bypass the capitalist media in innovative ways to take advantage of the breakup of ideological inertia. CNN and MSNBC are asking "What went wrong?" during and after Katrina and Rita. So the political bosses are vulnerable. They are suffering a crisis of legitimacy. Now we have to cite that illegitimacy, expand the question beyond what went wrong to how the system failed the people, and to recite the list of illegitimacy surrounding the war, cronyism, debt, everything. We have to implant some new categories to destabilize earlier ideas about how the system works.

Independent media, and the creative use of the internet are important for this. I hear all the stuff about everyone doesn't have access or skills for the internet, but that is not a reason not to use it. And combine it with printed material, CDs, documentary films, and community-based popular education.

9. Are there any further comments you would like to make?

Thanks.

Buzz this story!


READER COMMENTS ON
"Katrina Wilcox: An Interview With Stan Goff"
(24 Responses so far...)

COMMENT #1 [Permalink]
... Matt Schweder said on 9/28/2005 @ 2:31 pm PT...


Stan Goff claims: "I would be very suspicious of anyone who claimed to have THE solution."

Why? I know the solution.

Part of it is to forget about the hundreds of actionable crisis that hit us day after day, that serve only to keep us distracted, frustrated and hopeless.

Goff hit on it briefly but didn't go far enough when he said all these issues are interwoven. Well, if they're interwoven, perhaps there is a common factor which all these depressing problems have in common. Well, there is and it's the key to the solution.

We have no coherent vision of where we're going. Can you imagine lining up on a track and getting in the blocks to start a race, only to realize you had no idea where the finish line was? Would it matter how fast you were? Or how smart? Would it matter how well prepared your strategy was? No, none of these things would matter if you didn't know where you were running.

This is essentially what our country, and our world for that matter, is doing right now. We're all racing because everyone else is racing. Yet, we don't know where we're going. And while we run and run and run, we're killing our environment's ability to sustain our lives, killing our diversity and killing ourselves. And we're convinced that we must keep racing so we never even have the time to ponder if we should stop for directions.

What we need is a finish line: A vision of where we're going.

It's this vision that is the foundation upon which all other issues are framed. It's the vision of the Finish Line inside each of us that determines the decisions we make, the strategies we formulate and the races we run.

If you had to guess, and if you had to assume the entire world was following a single vision of the future and racing towards some ultimate goal, what would you guess that it was? Imagine the world as if you were traveling from another planet, working on a science project, and you had to describe what you saw on a daily basis on our planet.

It probably wouldn't be pretty. Numerous wars being fought all across the globe. Explosions everywhere. Poverty everywhere. Environmental destruction everywhere. Fighting everywhere. Can you imagine how all our destruction and fighting must sound if you could hear it at once from outer space?

Now imagine how different our world might be if our unified vision of our Finish Line was human beings as enlightened stewards of this biological miracle and masterpiece. Imagine what a place might look like where its inhabitants were racing towards this goal.

Imagine this new vision as the new foundation of our decision-making processes.

Might we then make different choices when it comes to energy, military, political, educational, transportation, social and other issues?

Well of course we would. And not because we were told to. It simply would be.

Instead we spend all our time fighting over a never-ending stream of unbelievable crimes against nature and humanity, not seeing or fighting the cause of each of them.

If we spread and live a new vision of human potential then we won't NEED to address all the distracting problems.

It might sound complicated but it's really quite simple. Or perhaps you think me too idealistic?

Only fear would think so. Or having no faith in our potential.

What's our Finish Line?

What's our Finish Line?


COMMENT #2 [Permalink]
... Nana said on 9/28/2005 @ 6:39 pm PT...


#1 M. Schweder

I'm not sure i understand how your plan can accomplish this.
1 Ignore crisis
2 Formulate a vision
3 Unify the world with that vision

How? Through enlightenment? Rules, laws, good leadership ?


COMMENT #3 [Permalink]
... Doug Eldritch said on 9/28/2005 @ 6:59 pm PT...


Now wait a minute stan, who's going after Michael Chertoff???

Michael Chertoff the biggest crook, neocon in ten years

Seriously? How did we get a crony like Chertoff who doesn't care about blacks, or anyone not on his payroll?

Is this the example of patheticness!??? Do we really have incompetent crooks everywhere?

Please everyone needs to make sure this guy Chertoff is thrown in jail.

Doug


COMMENT #4 [Permalink]
... Arry said on 9/28/2005 @ 9:46 pm PT...


About "the vision" --- I think in some ways, it is a matter of uncovering the vision; and much of it is done through detailed practical experience. Also, through education (in which blogs now are prominent.)

Strong vision usually emerges in a very difficult birth, but it seems to me that it always consists of learning and a strong moral dynamic.

That said, I think much of the vision already exists on some level in most people - strong communities, peace, healthy environment - but has been covered over and culturally manipulated by corporate and plutocratic interests to take the form of doublethink - that you can possess healthy aspirations that will only come to be by ignoring them for what "has to be". That's the sickness and stress of our society and the iniquity of a marketing culture.

Sustainability, democracy, community from the ground up --- these are what we have to focus on (in our necessary, real, and detailed struggle) as they strengthen and brighten the full vision.
----------------------------------------------------------

On another subject, I agree with Stan - and have been saying so for some time - that we have to "ratchet up" our resistance - boycotts, massive civil disobedience. But I don't agree that we should ignore elections. In the first place, all elections are not national, and on local levels they can be very useful in creating an environment conducive to development of a necessary infrastructure (as I mentioned on another thread.) In the second place, elections are the heart of democracy, and however corrupted they are, they are an essential element in the vision Matt spoke of. We are going nowhere if we don't work on our vision of democracy in practical terms.


COMMENT #5 [Permalink]
... Doug Eldritch said on 9/29/2005 @ 2:42 am PT...


Roy Blunt also linked to the Delay-Abramoff mafia, its time to expose this before all the media.

Clearly there is so many crooks in washington the 6 or 7 of us ought to start a HUGE organization just to track all the crimes, report them, and RESOLVE them by collective outcry!!!!!!!!

How many damn crooks need the lapel pinned on them? In republicans and democrats, especially crooked K-street democrats and anyone who is buddies with Abramoff.

Its time to make Abramoff radioactive, because well he is Tar every single person alive who is associated with Abramoff, make them realize this guy is a stain of corruption, bad for business, bad for everything. Sink the whole ship and throw it down the river!!!!!

Doug E.


COMMENT #6 [Permalink]
... Joan said on 9/29/2005 @ 9:54 am PT...


Re the vision thing: admirable, but not very realistic. The world is not going to sit down nicely & share a vision together. Too many cooks, real complicated pot.

I see the world, & this country, as small groups & large groups; this group over here trying to do this, that group over there trying to do that. Multiplied by x (a big number). Butting heads, locking horns, a big, cyclic, chaotic, ever-changing process, possibly orchestrated by gargantuan cosmic forces or possibly by an old bearded guy up on a cloud throwing lightning bolts, who the hell knows.
All you can do is pick your group & make your best efforts & hope for a safe landing at the end of the ride, where you either hook up with your 72 allotted virgins or blend blissfully into the karmic soup, clutching your ticket for the next go-round, if there is one.

I kinda like my group. I think we're gonna keep making noise & fighting the good fight, trying to spread peace & love & sanity till the planet explodes in a shower of pretty fireworks. I got nothin' better to do.


COMMENT #7 [Permalink]
... Lemmethink_not said on 9/29/2005 @ 11:47 am PT...


Matt.............and we run and we run to catch up to the sun,but its sinking.....Bliss is ignorance for a lot of folks....and we aparently have no "just stewards" out there. we must make a noise to be heard....and yes enlightenment,rules, laws and good leadership would damn sure help


COMMENT #8 [Permalink]
... ThomNYC said on 9/29/2005 @ 1:07 pm PT...


Just a thought...

Since Bush really seems completely unable to relate, what if we put Iraq into terms he and his cronies do notice???

A very basic funeral costs around $5000. Let's say we negotiated for some discount for "quantity".

$3500 per funeral. Bush writes a check out of his personal bank account each month for the discounted services.

September has been a pretty quiet month in terms of Iraq... only 49 deaths so far.

W writes a check on Monday, provided no other 19 year olds have their bodies blown to bits this weekend, for $171,500. I wonder how many months it would be "acceptible losses" for young men and women to die in Iraq then...


COMMENT #9 [Permalink]
... Doug Eldritch said on 9/29/2005 @ 2:43 pm PT...


NOTE: Chertoff is the weakest link, he is also connected to crony Matt Blunt!!!!

Focus on sending ALL of the Chertoff/Abramoff stories into the national media non-stop and connect Roy Blunt!

Attention all bloggers: Do good work today and send all of the Michael Chertoff stories to the national media repeatedly

This guy Chertoff is bad, bad news as is Abramoff. Its time we make him radioactive for the media and someone gets up and prosecutes the guy.

Remember Chertoff can not be defended: To defend Chertoff is to defend Abramoff, and people worse than Bush. We must bring this slime down, and he's easy pickins at this point!!

FULL Media contact list: Send them all the stories on RAWSTORY.com and the Michael Chertoff stories!!!

Lets do our job, we are the movers of the law!

Doug E.


COMMENT #10 [Permalink]
... Catherine a said on 9/29/2005 @ 3:45 pm PT...


Matt #1

This is a brilliant point. You're so right that we need to have a feel for where we're going--at the very least on a personal level.

How to get there? I have 2 ideas to contribute.

1) The more we each individually live and make daily choices consciously in alignment with our personal intent, the more practice we'll get. We can then become more skillful at doing this in other ways (e.g. within other groups in which we participate). Before we can have a collective intent we need to develop clarity on our personal intent.

Even on very small-scale collaborations (e.g. 2 people working on a project) it can sometimes be surprisingly difficult to agree on a clear statement of purpose and then to carry that out. It's a skill that can be honed; it requires commitment and honesty from all participants and no hidden agendas. It's worthwhile to work on no matter how challenging. At the very least it reveals where the "disconnects" are.

2) There are real-life examples of successful collective decision-making. The one that comes to mind is Porto Alegre in Brazil, a large metropolitan area where annual budget decisions are made by the LOCAL POPULATION. There are meetings held in all the local areas to educate people about upcoming decisions on everything from municipal plumbing upgrades to educational programs. This has been going on successfully for many years now. It has led to huge increases in literacy and education, better housing standards, elimination of most corruption, just to name a few outcomes. YES! Magazine had a good one-page article about this a year or two ago.


COMMENT #11 [Permalink]
... Nana said on 9/29/2005 @ 4:23 pm PT...


Joan

I love your outlook and wit! And you are right, this is a 'fighting the good fight', time for all, we will not give up.

I agree with Arry, re. what the focus should be, "sustainability, democracy, community, from the ground up-" and it is time to take control of our own destinies. In the words of Florynce R Kennedy
"Don't agonize, organize!"

Matt, i basically believe most people are good, and, when given the choice, will choose to do the right thing for family and environment. But there is a small group that is creating the "distracting problems", and they must be dealt with, IMHO


COMMENT #12 [Permalink]
... Doug Eldritch said on 9/29/2005 @ 7:11 pm PT...


Gasket blows wide open: Larry Franklin to sing on AIPAC including Douglas Feith.

Plus Judith Miller released on plea-bargain....Can you say conspiracy charges.......If we're going to bring all the neocon-zionists down we need to damn well stay ahead of them and go through the backdoor.

Doug E.


COMMENT #13 [Permalink]
... Lindy said on 9/29/2005 @ 7:46 pm PT...


#12 - DOUG E !!! WOW! WOO HOO! WHATTA NIGHT!!!

Any news coverage on cnn, msnbc, etc., yet?


COMMENT #14 [Permalink]
... Doug Eldritch said on 9/29/2005 @ 8:20 pm PT...


Story on CNN and MSNBC, also coverage on NBC later. I wonder when the Democrats will make a statement...?

Doug E.


COMMENT #15 [Permalink]
... Doug Eldritch said on 9/29/2005 @ 11:50 pm PT...


Shit, I just realized something........It all came together and hit me like a ton of bricks.

Judith Miller is THE SOURCE FOR THE LEAK.

She is going to try to pin it on Libby, Rove as part of the conspiracy.

But Miller is the source, she was a PLANT who was working alongside Bolton the whole time and she and Bolton learned of Plame directly from that guy Steve Fleitz when they were all in that room together.....

She then discussed it with Libby and Cheney learned it from their conversations with the CIA plants.

JUDITH MILLER IS THE SOURCE. I'M DAMN NEAR POSITIVE NOW. SHE'S GOING TO TRY TO WALK OUT OF THIS ONE WITHOUT NAMING HER PARTNER, JOHN BOLTON!!!!!!!!!!!

Doug E.


COMMENT #16 [Permalink]
... NuclearChemist said on 9/30/2005 @ 8:54 am PT...


Doug,

I have a question for you. Are you against AIPAC because they are a lobbying firm or because they are for Israel or both?


COMMENT #17 [Permalink]
... Doug Eldritch said on 9/30/2005 @ 1:54 pm PT...


Nuke,

You ought to know the answer to that. I'm against them totally because they're a shadow-lobbying firm for Israel's government who doesn't have good intentions in mind at all!!!

Have you read the indictment case yet??? Yeah that's what I thought. Ariel Sharon has this game tied up!

Doug E.


COMMENT #18 [Permalink]
... NuclearChemist said on 9/30/2005 @ 9:14 pm PT...


Doug,

So what is your position on Israel? That the arabs should be able to invade Israel and kill every Jew they see?


COMMENT #19 [Permalink]
... Doug Eldritch said on 9/30/2005 @ 11:42 pm PT...


Nuke,

No my position is the countries should be permanently seperated and agree to the NATO resolutions to have no further involvement with another. Disagreements be handled in court.

IE: No more taking any oil from eachother, and they are forced to adopt alternative fuel sources like the rest of the world.

Iraqis have been crying for it for ages, its time we present full fledged solutions and leave oil behind.

Doug E.


COMMENT #20 [Permalink]
... NuclearChemist said on 10/1/2005 @ 6:57 am PT...


Oh, I agree that we should get our own fuel. Did you hear that they are looking at turning coal into gasoline? Just like the Nazi's did. You take coal and water, pressure and temperature and you get basic hydrocarbons that can be turned back into gasoline (using a catalyst). I think they said it was economically feasable if oil prices stay above $30 barrel.


COMMENT #21 [Permalink]
... Arry said on 10/1/2005 @ 7:42 am PT...


Wow, hydrocarbons. What a concept!


COMMENT #22 [Permalink]
... Joan said on 10/1/2005 @ 10:38 am PT...


Nana #11,
Thanks for the kind words. Gotta laugh so I don't cry!!!


COMMENT #23 [Permalink]
... Doug Eldritch said on 10/1/2005 @ 3:48 pm PT...


Yeah Arry, who would've thought of that? :-P

Plus Coal is the worst thing for the environment there is. If the zionist nazis want to use Coal, they're no better than the pillagers of this earth and do a dis-service to the Jewish people and whole world.

We have hydrogen based carbons right around the corner. There's no need for any more COAL!!!!!!

Doug


COMMENT #24 [Permalink]
... Joe said on 1/20/2006 @ 3:55 am PT...


Solution? there is no solution short of re-engineering the miserable human species. Unfortunately that reengineering will be done by the ruling class. The solution if any will be for "them" not "us".


-=- Comments on this item are now closed. -=-


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