READER COMMENTS ON
"The Velvet Revolution Begins..."
(71 Responses so far...)
COMMENT #1 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 3:47 pm PT...
Thank you Brad. America needs a lot more people like you!
COMMENT #2 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 4:07 pm PT...
Beautiful, Brad. True to your excellent taste.
COMMENT #3 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 4:12 pm PT...
Signed up already. Spreading the link around...
COMMENT #4 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 5:28 pm PT...
Quite an intuitive site ...
COMMENT #5 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 5:36 pm PT...
Very good Brad...very organized. Will get in soon!
COMMENT #6 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 5:40 pm PT...
Great! Thanks all! Get over there and cause some trouble! And bring a few friends with ya!
Regular BRAD BLOGGING to resume shortly...Sorry for the slight delay...
COMMENT #7 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 5:56 pm PT...
Brad - This is so exciting. I was just thinking today that the net is great, but there needs to be a central coordinating point, and this could be it. I have only started reading everything.
Thank you so much for Conyers' letter. He needs millions of people to help him - the Dem. Sens. (except for the wonderful Sen. Boxer) and Republicans won't help - but that's good! Less interference the better.
I think a lot of good can come of Kerry's quitting so soon: (1) Maybe the Dem. Sens. told him they would not support his fight. They didn't help Gore the way they should have. They did not support Conyers. They need a come-uppance (2) Maybe he knew he couldn't win without enough support, and maybe he was advised the Dems. would fight against him (3) Maybe it's better that the Bushites get exposed for the fraudsters they are and go down in flames, rather than just being voted out (4) maybe the American people need to find out what's been going on, get involved and stay forever vigilant (5) if Kerry got the most votes, then let's put the "Reluctant President" into the White House and demand he do the job he promised - he was a hero once, and I believe the hero is still there inside.
The problem with the corporations is greed. There is nothing wrong with making a profit. The problem is that no amount of profit seems to be enough, and at any expense: loss of jobs for workers, loss of health, loss of pensions, loss of the environment, loss of integrity, loss of time for families and children, loss of decency, loss of freedom, loss of justice, loss of life itself. A new capitalistic system must be devised, where the goal is that everyone has an education and job for the necessities in life, and every gain in society does not become a loss in another's - the zero sum game is an absolute lie -and that attitude needs to be eliminated from our daily living.
Thanks again for all your work. A New Year's toast for "Success in Truth and Justice for All".
COMMENT #8 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 6:04 pm PT...
COMMENT #9 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 6:50 pm PT...
I've already sent links to a great many people, and more lists will follow. Thanks, Brad.
COMMENT #10 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 6:56 pm PT...
Brad - Is anyone going to film the Jan 21-23 Progressive Summit (for those of us who cannot attend) - I can also foresee that portions of this Summit will be included in a future Michael Moore-Type Documentary.
COMMENT #11 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 7:16 pm PT...
I have an interesting, potentially threatening experience to report to you all. For the past 36 hours or so, whenever I've stayed on a Progressive site for longer than four or five minutes, by server connection has been cut and I can't get back online. I was just registering at VR, flipped over to my e-mail for the login stuff, and was cut off. It's not just annoying, it's a little frightening too. Because I called our server three times, and there was nothing going on with their equipment - no heavy traffic or anything. I've even reloaded the server and restarted three times. It still occurs. But NOT when I'm just doing routine stuff.
COMMENT #12 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 7:20 pm PT...
P.S. My e-mail from VR has still not come in, and it's been fifteen minutes. I'm sure that's not right.
COMMENT #13 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 7:52 pm PT...
No, my e-mail is being blocked now. It says the server has terminated the connection even though I can see on the task bar than I'm still online.
COMMENT #14 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 8:03 pm PT...
Looking into it, Peg...Not sure what the problem may be. Is there bad weather in your area right now? (Like in mine! We've been getting brownouts for the last hour or so)
COMMENT #15 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 8:20 pm PT...
Excellent opening! You have worked so hard for us Brad. THANK YOU!
Everyone please join Velvet Revolution and help us affect a renewal of democracy in America. Our country needs YOU and your friends now! We will in deed prevail!
COMMENT #16 [Permalink]
Terri in S. FL
said on 1/10/2005 @ 8:46 pm PT...
Just wanted to say that I got into VR with no problems. I really don't think "they" want to bump us, so much as watch us.
Have you noticed how much attention blogs are getting on the main stream media? Stenaphalos (sp) actually asked Powell about something that was on a blog, and Powell used that opportunity to, well, you know what they do: radical leftie whackos, does not represent real Amerika, blah, blah, you guys know the routine.
Anyway, they're talking, so they're nervous. First they laugh, then they fear, then you beat them (or something like that).
Anyway, check out the VR, and thanks to Brad.
COMMENT #17 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 8:50 pm PT...
I'll be going to VR just as soon as I finish here. Thanks Brad for making a place for hope to reside.
COMMENT #18 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 8:59 pm PT...
Guess you are all aware of the TurnYourBackOnBush plan for Jan. 20. Another great idea. I hope C-span carries it live so I can watch all the wonderful revolutionists - then click the revolting Bushites off my terminal - don't like to see viruses on my computer.
COMMENT #19 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 9:19 pm PT...
Thanks for answering, Brad. It's definitely incoming e-mail that is blocked. See, I can get through here. I have yet another call through to the server, who insists that there's nothing amiss at their end. But it obviously isn't me and my modem either. Time to switch servers? Or go to DirecWay?
Thanks for calming my nerves somewhat; but the past two days have been eerie.
COMMENT #20 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 9:23 pm PT...
P.S. And no to the bad weather. It is a warmish, calm night here, with zero flickering of lightbulbs.
COMMENT #21 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 9:35 pm PT...
Brad & all,
You all are great! Like I've prodded...the revolution must come in the form that will achieve results! I hope this will be one of them. In discussions with other revolutionary friends, we were all in relative agreement that a central face to resistance would benefit the movement since there is so much competing "noise" out there right now. But it is also going to require decentralized networking that includes "offline" work and communication.
I cannot emphasize that last line enough! For those of you who may have believed that some of my thoughts were too far left for serious consideration, I would like to repeat an article offered in a thread yesterday by Karen R. And in doing so, I would also recommend you keep abreast of various comments throughout Brad Blog that carry some very informative information! Whether comments are directly related to the post or not, there have been some very valuable comments in threads that you should consider just part of the whole BRAD BLOG fabric here! Stitching together that fabric in your own mind, and with others, will help you organize and prepare!
If you are truly serious about understanding our government and what direction we're headed, may I again direct you to Karen R.'s offering. It should be required reading for every AMERICAN!:
There are some very important reasons that you must view this information in understanding the power of FEMA, the secret government, as it relates to our efforts here. Under a state of national emergency or crisis, FEMA will be provided extraordinary total control powers, whether the crisis is created as a result of a domestic or international disaster, or contrived to seize power over all governments, property, and peoples of the United States.
This would include the seizure, control, or shutting down of BRAD BLOG, other progressive sites, and the entire Internet! Also, all other media and communications services, cell phones, telephones, radio stations, television networks, and newspapers.
It would also include mass arrests and detentions of pre-selected leaders or groups, especially left-wing or minority citizens. These powers can even be invoked to prevent Americans from protesting America's intervention in a foreign war, such as Iraq! Is it any wonder that there is increased domestic military and intelligence operations designed to infiltrate or disrupt anti-war protests, anti-Bush protests, or any opposition to a potential right-wing military takeover!
As I jokingly referred to as "CRAMPS", the Corrupt Right-wing American Military Police State, some time ago! Read about FEMA's powers and please advise me if I'm joking, or merely part of the lunatic fringe along with all these other left-wing "KOOKS" or "CONSPIRACY THEORISTS" who have been gathering here and ridiculed by certain visitors of the conservative persuasion?
As I have repeatedly advised, the merging of Christian Dominionism with America's Military Industrial Complex is a very serious and real threat. Please take note of the FEMA exercise conducted by LT. COL. Oliver North during the Reagan Administration, mentioned in the above listed article, when they actually planned to implement FEMA's seizure powers. You will note how you could only get into the emergency command center wearing a special "Christian" cross or crucifix!
My friends! We are definitely at a national crossroads! One can only wonder, if George Bush wasn't relected, would some "contrived" disaster precipitate a FEMA police state operation? When General Tommy Franks tells us that our rights under the Constitution will be gone with a major terrorist attack, one can only wonder, who will actually orchestrate and carry out that attack to remove our Constitution and empower FEMA, or CRAMPS, as our new government?
When tanks start showing up at recent American protests, or the US military is already strategically patrolling our airports, or the US military and intelligence community has already begun domestic survelliance, disruption, or intimidation of anti-war efforts and opposition groups, where are we headed my friends? I have a clue! Now we know why they're building all these miltary detention camps on US military bases in America, as well as the multimillion dollar expansion of the Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, detention center! Is it for the invading Muslim hordes? I don't think so!
So after you take that drink, or two, or three, (I HAVE REALLY GREAT TEQUILA! then start spreading the word as far, as fast, and to as many people you can reach, and then really do the patriotic thing:
Tell them to read:
and have them join our discussion and efforts at BRAD BLOG! (No I'm really not Brad disguised as a Freebird glowing with self-promotion...LOL!)
I am Freebird! (Good night NSA...you all really need to shower every now and then!)
COMMENT #22 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 9:43 pm PT...
Great commentary, Freebird. And judging from my experiences, none too soon. I'll try again with VR when I can again receive e-mail (if ever) ;-\
COMMENT #23 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 9:54 pm PT...
Dear Freebird, I will read the website as you advise, but I firmly believe the American troops will turn on the Bushites before they turn on the American people. The Bushites may blindly believe in their "new religion", but frankly most people are not blind and can see they're quite insane and destructive. What you say is always possible, but not likely, as yet. And Americans are still armed for just this purpose, aren't they - to fight an unjust government. Take it easy on the tequila??? - Bless you Freebird.
COMMENT #24 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 9:59 pm PT...
congrats and thanks, Brad! VR is an excellent idea to help bring us all together. i hope that many people will use it and contribute to it, and really be a part of it, to create an INclusive, thriving community that is a force for positive change. it is a heartening sign that all over the internet(s!) people are finding their voices!
i am cheered to know that people of goodwill can work toward common goals for the good of us all.
i know this is going to sound corny, but remember that those Founding Fathers were just regular people, like you and me, who not only decided to speak up --- they also decided to personally participate. they still had their families and their jobs and the grind of daily life --- but just look what they accomplished! it wasn't quick, it certainly wasn't easy, but those 'everyday people' were able to create the best form of government yet known to man.
we can do this. the journey of a thousand miles begins with one step.
COMMENT #25 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 10:05 pm PT...
Wonderful Brad! You are my man. I am pretty exhausted and need to get back to work (self employed).
Electionsmoking was born as the 2004 presidential elections were again smoking in flames..... I am directing all my audience, friends, family, fans at electionsmoking.blogspot.com to Velvet Revolution.
I am personally recomending to people to join Velvet Revolution.
Once again great going everybody including Brad!!
COMMENT #26 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 10:38 pm PT...
COMMENT #27 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 11:02 pm PT...
You guys are great! I want to join you at VR. But I attempted to register and my server blocked my e-mails. And this in a "Blue" state.
COMMENT #28 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 11:09 pm PT...
Thanks Peg C and I'll try Peggy (On The Tequila that is! LOL)
It would be difficult to see them implementing FEMA powers without a really traumatic tragedy, such as a nuclear war, etc. What is disturbing, is that they are indeed preparing to use it against the American people to quell domestic disturbance, even mass protest, and to any other extent their secret plans may desire. Who decides what, where, and when? When GOD tells George DUMBYA to act? God help us! LOL
As the article points out, even a contrived event or tragedy may invoke those powers. I'm sure the FEMA bureaucarcy is just like the Pentagon one, always preparing or scheming for one event or another. So I'm sure they're ready to exercise those powers in a pre-planned scenario, such as lining up the "right" media, religious, and political leaders to advise America why their takeover is necessary. As with so many other things, I'm sure there are many Americans, especially in the Christian right or who are otherwise conservative, that will buy the government line...hook, line, and sinker!
Necessary for the national security! Necessary to save America! Be PATRIOTIC! Stand by your government in a time of crisis! The right-wing controlled military and government, with so many right-wing recruited soldiers, would probably have no problem enforcing the edicts against their fellow Americans, especially if those Americans were already publicly villified as "kooks", "traitors", "criminals" or "terrorists"!
You can be assured that with any FEMA action, the governments right-wing spin machine, military and intelligence psy-ops, and already in hand media will become part of the total propaganda package. The takeover would happen with well prepared publicity and promotion. I bet FOX News already has a jingle for it! And the government has a slick operational mantra, like OPERATION ENDURING FREEDOM!
So it won't just be a political takeover...it will be part of a mass marketing campaign to indoctrinate (sell) the American people before, during, and after the seizure. This brings me back to other threads and commentary. Remember winter patriot's blog about how Vietnam protestors were infiltrated and discredited. FEMA action will not proceed without a similar form of fraud and deception!
These people employ publicity consultants, media agencies, even mass thought psychologists to advise them on manipulating opinion and exploiting fears. And you're paying for it! So I don't really take comfort in the thought that the military would simply abandon the effort, or that people would rise up in rebellion, because I believe FEMA is working both the strategic and marketing aspects of dealing with all such scenarios.
Would it succeed? Probably not! The problem is the fact that they believe it might and therefore orchestrate a tragedy out of their confidence to make it work. And what would be the consequence of their misjudgment? What would be destroyed? How many killed? They have already considered employing these powers several times, and without effective oversight or control...just what idiot will make the tragic decision?
But I do have faith! I have faith that the United States government doesn't know the difference between its head and its ass! If Iraq proves anything, it proves the government still has that head between its legs! But that still doesn't mean such butt heads cannot do great harm to our country and world! We need to pull the head out so it can see again and smell fresh air!
Whether we do that with velvet or a crow bar, is yet to be seen! Nite all!
COMMENT #29 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2005 @ 11:40 pm PT...
LALLL - "Laugh a lot less loudly"
They need a "contrived event?" Something along the lines of 9/11 or something? All they need to do, it seems, is dial 1-800-al-Qaeda, and help is on the way. FEMA, you angel of mercy in hurricanes exacerbated by global warming, your time will come.
Freebird, take a break from outrage. You have plenty of backups, who are just as reckless as you and ready to jump into the breach. What else is a nature-loving granny to do?
COMMENT #30 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 2:07 am PT...
If they have to have a tragic event, we will get through it.
Their whole reign of terror has been a tragic event and we have matured and seasoned a bit.
We are toughening up. And the collective higher mind is involved. The Internet is adding a unique dimension to political activism..... MIND CONTROL, used by the commoner.
Websites are a matter of personal taste. This one is highly unique and artistically beautiful, so it appeals to me that way. And I also love the simplicity.
Everyone is different, and VR is going to get a huge amount of traffic.
Some of us like fewer bloggers on board, posting anyway, so we elaborately expressive types can have our say and resond to all replies, at length if need-be. It encourages more intellectual conversations, when you have time, which also appeals to me.
The Milgram experiments were interesting. Apparently not everyone went along with the orders. They are the ones I am most interested in.
Could the freedom to choose become more attractive to these blind followeres, somehow?
By reward, by example? If the ones who chose not to comply avoided pain and guilt, couldn't that be made appealing? Not by pointing out their failure as followers, but by praising them for their independent action.
COMMENT #31 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 2:45 am PT...
I thought I'd leave you with this quote I came across tonight.
"Celestial bodies do not deviate from their orbits and all events in nature occur with fixed regularity. Is the same with human society: only such laws as are rooted in popular sentiment can be enforced, while laws violating this sentiment merely arouse resentment.
It is enthusiasm that enables us to install helpers for the completion of an undertaking without fear of secret opposition. It is enthusiasm too that can unify mass movements so that they achieve victory."
COMMENT #32 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 7:19 am PT...
Hi, Everybody - Irvthom #30 - I'm counting on things being different this time, because most of the troops are in/coming/going to Iraq. I'm willing to bet big money, if I had any, that most of them would be relieved to see the Bushites get on that new luxury yacht they're purchasing and quickly get lost forever in the Bermuda Triangle. I recommend an extended trip between June and September - the weather's just great! My fingers and toes are crossed.
COMMENT #33 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 7:58 am PT...
I was just thinking...
once we fix this Bushite problem, which shouldn't take too long, since they'll probably self-destruct with a little prodding...
and start tackling this greedy corporation problem...
and now that we have an inkling of what it's like, we will have to start talking with our disadvantaged brothers and sisters throughout the world (I like Aljazeera)...
When you think of all the effort, aggravation, time and money that goes into fighting, squabbling, and destruction, it would be far easier to work together to solve problems...the feeling of satisfaction from the achievement of worthwhile goals is wonderful (and makes us all glow and look younger)...As a civil engineering professor once said, trying to impress his first year college students, it's better than SEX...
This is not a pipe dream...it is achievable...people just have to decide that this is what they want...and then, with effort, make it happen...what can be more pressing?
Have a great day, All.
COMMENT #34 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 9:31 am PT...
I would add read this too to your link.
Secrets within secrets. "Toto, we are not virgins anymore" (we been screwed).
COMMENT #35 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 10:04 am PT...
LOL...thanks for the future blog suggestion BRAD!
Although, I would make this point about all our efforts, blogging included. As I had pointed out earlier in this thread, there does need to be some centralized coordination in the varying voices out there. Right now there is a lot of noise, which is great, but I worry about the diffusion of voices with so many blogs and forms of media.
In a certain way, a lack of focus with objectives may only play into the hands of a well-oiled, well-funded, and well-organized right-wing Christian Conservative movement, which is becoming much better at honing its message and impacting collective thought, regardless of how we view or disregard its propaganda.
They offer a complete package! An overarching ideology that keeps their soldiers in place, ready and willing to act at the press of a button or a beep on their cell phone. Plus, they have face to face offline organization and communication, as I had also commented upon. They are multi-dimensional in their approach and I honestly believe we have to prevent ourselves from becoming uni-dimensional.
If all the right-wing government has to do is to turn off the Internet to stop our movement, or monitor our voices online to prepare a response or learn a defense, then we may be defeating our own cause in the long run. So when I spoke of conventions, pamphlets, and "offline" organization and communication, I was being quite serious. Not to be pessimistic, but to be practical and effective.
Also, we have many voices for various issues, including election reform, environmental justice, sexual freedom, minority rights, political reform, and so on and so on. The totality of those voices comprises the opposition while the opposition speaks more and more with one voice with a simple, clear, and uncluttered message. I am just analyzing the problem here, but somehow we have to develop our own coherent progressive message.
The problem again is organization. They have basically seized control of the Republican Party, they have offline organization at the grass-roots religious level, and they have disciplined funding through corporate, religious, and media venues. Plus, whether we like it or not, they are in power and are centralizing that power in greater strength through the consolidation of media. Therefore, the consolidation and control over collective thought.
So I think the real question is, how do we organize both "online and offline" to hone our own coherent progressive message that counteracts their own disciplined organization? How do we organize and fund our own collective thought to counteract their control over both power and media? Is it through the Democratic Party? I don't believe so, simply because corporate America, the Military Industrial Complex, and other wealthy power interests have effectively compromised the Party to make it an ineffective opposition. The SYSTEM OF TWO...no matter who wins..."they" win!
I know you all just love my ravings (LOL), but I am trying to make you think about and look at a picture much larger than election reform and other issues, and start thinking about what it will take to organize our collective mass consciousness into a serious on-the-ground movement that becomes a direct threat to status quo existence.
I'm afraid if we go issue by issue, like we have been, with a diffusion of voices and energy, then they will pick us off, issue by issue, election by election, as they work to consolidate even greater power through media control, election fraud, and the increasing concentration of wealth at the top, all through discplined organization and messages.
Yes, both human nature and spiritual nature, we'll eventually catch up with them, but I'd like us to get their first, before they do any further damage to our country, our humanity, and our environment.
You are right Peg C...it is rage...but a very focused rage that calls for employing our voices and energy in an effective challenge to what they are doing to us and our world multi-dimensionally. I believe we have to respond in just as many dimensions, if not more! Brad Blog and the Velvet Revolution is great, but the Internet is only one dimension. We need to consolidate that dimension with other methods to achieve the results we are looking for and defeat the opposition.
We have to be more than just a resistance...we have to actually resist!
My apologies for taking up space BRAD and I hope to everyone that I am making a contribution to your thoughts and ideas, even though I tend to be more philosophical than practical. Socratically shall we learn?
COMMENT #36 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 10:38 am PT...
Thanks! I agree!
I will add Dredd's site at comment #37 as a must read indeed! FEMA, FISC, FISA...all these secret government organizations and courts must be brought to light and either eliminated or brought back under the control of a PEOPLE's CONSTITUTION with effective controls and oversight.
We are no longer truly free if we must walk a plank blindfolded by our own government. Ruled by fear instead of justice, national security instead of individual rights! VIVA LA REVOLUCION!
COMMENT #37 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 10:43 am PT...
Point very well made, Freebird #38. Will think about it. Thanks.
COMMENT #38 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 10:48 am PT...
You are certainly correct! Too many people focus on Bush as the problem. Personality is really not our problem, the very structure of our government has become the problem. Even if Kerry was elected, we'd still have a corrupt state structure to deal with and that has to be addressed.
COMMENT #39 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 11:17 am PT...
If a revolution exists and then "wins" what does it become after that?
COMMENT #40 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 11:51 am PT...
You are so right about the organizational real-world problems we have. Making progress in effecting real change is a hands-on process, not simply a discussion but a strategy that requires actual physical participation. We Progressives in my town, county and state are working on just that.
But blogsites like this one are a good place to crystallize our insights and just plain relieve the pressure of outrage.
Besides, it's nice to know there are so many of us.
COMMENT #41 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 11:56 am PT...
Replying to FreeBird (who, yes, does need a blog! ...
So I think the real question is, how do we organize both 'online and offline' to hone our own coherent progressive message that counteracts their own disciplined organization?"
That is precisely the question that VR is attempting to answer and the role I hope that it will fill.
And why I hope you guys will head over there, speak up there as well as here, and use that broader to forum to organize precisely as Freebird postulates.
The Election Reform movement is a no-brainer, and one that has the proven ability to bring such folks together. At VR, that is our first order of business, but the "VR Watch" area is to take a look at what those same folks also have on their mind, and how we might mobilize that Election Reform energy, not just towards Election Reform, but towards many of the other issue that folks here speak about regularly.
VR is able to *mobilize* folks in ways that BRAD BLOG is somewhat limited in being able to do.
So again...check it out, use it, it's there to accomplish much of what you guys have been talking about here! Take advantage of that!
COMMENT #42 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 12:07 pm PT...
I have a few disagreements to express tonight...
First, with Peggy, who says "...but I firmly believe the American troops will turn on the Bushites before they turn on the American people."
I seem to recall an event in 1970, Peggy, when the troops took their orders seriously, at Kent State, and fired into a crowd of student protestors, killing several of them. Then there was the famous 'Milgram Experiments' that time after time demonstrated how people can be led to obey orders, no matter how obvious their deadly outcome becomes. That's exactly why revolution --- even the velvet sort --- is a risky game to play.
Second, with Des, who says "...remember that those Founding Fathers were just regular people, like you and me, who not only decided to speak up --- they also decided to personally participate. they still had their families and their jobs and the grind of daily life."
I'm sorry to bust that bubble, Des, but the Founding Fathers were quite wealthy landowners who had others (most often slaves) doing their jobs and 'the grind of daily life.' They objected to the heavy burden that THEIR King George put them under, economically, to maintain their standard of living. Yes, they had some very noble ideas about basic liberties and such, but their compromises with each other cursed the new country with its historical burden of slavery . . . AND the framework of Capitalism that became the root cause of all our plagues today.
Lastly, I'm afraid I have to disagree with the particular interactive software on the new Velvet Revolution site. This is a tough one because I know how valuable is the entire concept of the site. However, I have been far more satisfied with the simple and easy-to-use comment software right here on Bradblog. Many discussion sites use that other more elaborate style, but I have never found it easy or inviting to work with. I hope that this site, here, continues to be maintained and used.
Sorry, Brad, but I have to call it as I see it.
COMMENT #43 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 12:07 pm PT...
Miss P...the government! But hopefully, the right one!
I have a suggestion, after thinking a bit about my own questions. To coordinate our disparate progressive voices, maybe we should call for a more structured progressive movement?
Just some thoughts, but there are many groups that are competing in the noise factory for various reasons, membership, money, influence, ego, and the list goes on.
I have been involved in the environmental movement for many years and there are many competing voices over what in reality are common goals. I am not suggesting those various organizations stop existing or competing, but start cooperating more, especially politically!
As an example, if you have let's say 50 environmental groups, then let's get each of those groups to elect or appoint a leader to an overarching progressive environmental council that coordinates their efforts and share ideas at a certain level. I realize this already exists in a certain form, but not completely and not in the way I'm thinking.
Set aside environmental groups for a moment and then consider all other progressive causes/groups:
liberal think tanks
All these causes or groups have their own variety of competing or overlapping organizations. Just as I am recommending for environmental groups, these organizations would create their own progressive council comprising a member from each organization. A labor council, an election reform council, a peace council, etc...
These respective councils would then appoint a member to an overarching progressive council that embodies all progressive issues. This relates back to my suggestion that we need to be more multi-dimensional, even hierarchial, while still not relying on such a structure alone to achieve desired results.
But it speaks to the need of developing a more clear and coherent progressive message. This would include invading Republican territory on religious issues, not to be more right-wing than Republicans, but just the opposite, to be more moderate and progressive and start peeling away the religious base of the Republicans, making them sound like the "KOOKS!" Bringing front and center people like Rev. Ford at Riverside Church in New York and other moderate religious voices to counteract and neutralize the right-wing demagoguery of Christian Dominionists.
I understand that various groups within issues don't always get along or necessarily agree with each other, but I also don't believe these groups and causes will be realistically effective as long as they remain both DIVIDED and CONQUERED! So I am recommending the formation of progressive councils that can start honing a more united and coherent message for what is truely just in all our human and natural relationships.
COMMENT #44 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 12:10 pm PT...
LOL....I caught your comment after I had already written and sent mine Brad, but we're starting to think along the same lines.
COMMENT #45 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 12:10 pm PT...
oops! irvthom (#30) you are right-- i was thinking more about "Revolutionaries" like Paul Revere and Samuel Adams, regular guys who (if i remember correctly from history class) kept their businesses going while also working toward revolution...
the point being that it IS possible for ordinary people to change the world for the better.
COMMENT #46 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 12:27 pm PT...
Brad - I have a question about posting comments at the VR site. Does one hit "Quote" at a particular thread level or what. The typing box is already filled with the item to be commented upon! Why?
Oh, and BTW, thank you very much for facilitating my entry into VR. ))
COMMENT #47 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 12:31 pm PT...
Thrilled to see all is well with the Revolution. I've been thinking about you guys but unable to escape life's demands of late. Some of you may have read the lastest at BBV(.org) regarding Votehere and their so called "Crypto Solution" as a cure for the paper trail problem with e-voting. They will be here in Seattle tomorrow evening to pitch their so called verifiable solution to e-voting. I hope to attend and get the scoop on how they hope to fool us again.
I'll try to report in once I return to home base. I've been a news, info., and political junkie most of my adult life. In the run up to the election I couldn't get enough of the latest news on any and all media outlets. After Nov.2nd I had to institute a self imposed media black out because I felt physically ill even tuning into N.P.R. because of WHAT WASN'T BEING SAID. Finding AirAmerica, BBV, Brad Blog and others saved my sanity. Thank You Brad and the entire Bradville clan for rescueing me from the abyss...
COMMENT #48 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 12:47 pm PT...
The Clint Curtis story needs support in the mainline press or it will die … Brad needs your help.
With the Electoral Vote Rebellion in the news thoughts of vote fraud is on the minds of all mainline newspaper editors. That now makes "Vote Fraud" an acceptable mainline newspaper story. Suggestion … all Bradblog readers should contact newspapers in major markets such as Chicago, LA, NY, Dallas etc. and demand the Clint Curtis story be covered and "investigated".
All Bradblog posters should access the "Progressive Democrats of America" web site. The "PDA" site offers direct research and email links to all Congressmen, Committees etc. plus it offers the same with all "newspapers, TV, radio and new services". When in the PDA site click on "Action Alerts" …then plug in the zip code you want under "Guide To The Media" then click on it….. up pops a complete list of local media with parent companies also listed. Then just click on one of the companies… up pop's all management names, addresses, phone numbers and blue linked "email address's"…. then click on the email address and a message box pop's up with their managements name & email address in it . … then all you do is, at the bottom, fill in "your" name address information once and save it. Then cut and paste the same message while sending it to different people over and over and over … you can send out 50 or 75 messages an hour to different people with the use of the Microsoft BACK button and cut&paste. You know the drill … a truly wonderful site.
With a list of zip codes from the Internet you can cover every major media market in the US.
However, I'm not computer savvy enough to make direct links work on this site. Sooooooo….if one of you wonderful people could please cut and paste this message with the PDA web site link intact … it would be appreciated. Also, please cut & paste it to the Velvet Rev site ASAP.
Time is right to send messages about "Clint Curtis, YEI & Feeney " … it needs to be investigated.
The mainline press might bite!
COMMENT #49 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 12:48 pm PT...
SeattleDem - Happy to see the folks in Bradville have been helpful in your recovery. Mine too.
Irvthom - Never any need to apologize for disagreeing with anything here. We encourage same. Perhaps it's those guys on the far Right who frown on such things. We don't!
As to the software there, versus here. Different purposes. The Comments feature here is indeed very simple to use. But it's also not sophisticated enough to handle the traffic, and different discussion threads that VR will need to accomodate.
Though I hope to simplify it over there as much as possible, it's still necessary to have threaded conversations, unlike the long "flat" ones that we have to offer here.
VR will serve a different purpose than BRAD BLOG, even though will have common elements no doubt.
But where I was forced --- by nature or NPR, as SeattleDem pointed out --- to be a "news service" of sorts in the vaccum left by the MSM after the Election, I will be very happy to return more to my blogging on a wider variety of topics, allowing me to have more fun, more freedom, and more time to investigate whatever I wish to (Clint Curtis issues for example).
I lead the discussion here, in a way, by the items I post about. Over there, it's *you* guys who get to take it wherever you want!
So BRAD BLOG is indeed not going anywhere. No worries.
And hopefully, we'll even make some blog software available at VR in the future, so you guys (Hello, Freebird?) can make all the noise you want about whatever is on your mind! That's down the road though.
Stick with us over there, Irvthom. Hopefully, we'll continue to make things easier for you, and you'll get a bit more used to it at the same time.
There will be many changes to come.
On the good side of things it took the BRAD BLOG *atleast* six months or so to get the traffic that VR got in it's first half-day of existence.
So maybe we're onto to something. I suspect we are...otherwise, I don't think it all would have occured to me to bother with it in the first place.
Please go make noise!
COMMENT #50 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 1:16 pm PT...
Our Reps.and Senators are the keys,staying imformed,keeping up with the laws,the bills being introduced,go to Congress.org,keep up with the elerts.Keep emailing,faxing and calling our people in congress,stay behind them,encourage them to stand up for us,remind them that we voted them in,we can vote them out.Plan,boycott the media ,tell them you are,look what was done with the massive emailing and others things we did with the Jan.6th hearing.Most of all,pray,God's Word say when two or more ask in my name,it will be done,think how many there are of us.
COMMENT #51 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 1:23 pm PT...
Are these Republicans basically mercenaries?
How would your multilevel approach affect the government?
COMMENT #52 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 2:35 pm PT...
Thanks for your blog and for your impressive work! I fully support your progressive democratic initiative www.velvetrevolution.us.
I also support the progressive democratic movement in the Ukraine. However I do not support the neoliberal policies of Viktor Yushchenko, who was brought to power (again) through the 'velvet revolution' in the Ukraine.
The people of Ukraine will in no way gain economic justice from their recent 'velvet revolution.' See:
IMF Sponsored "Democracy" in The Ukraine
by Michel Chossudovsky
Let the velvet revolution in the US begin!, but let it be run by grassroots, by ordinary people, not by neoliberal institutions like the National Endowment for Democracy (NED) as it was in the Ukraine.
Hopes and greetings from Denmark,
COMMENT #53 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 2:55 pm PT...
Peg C. Are you still having problems with your internet service? I hadn't until today and then all of a sudden either I couldn't get on or couldn't stay on the connection or go anywhere once I got on.
Called my ISP and asked if they were having problems, the answer was no, but she suggested that I go to lavasoft.de and download a free spyware program called Ad-aware SE and run it. That seemed to cure the problem. My computer was full of spyware!
COMMENT #54 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 3:36 pm PT...
Val...I'm sure our voting machines are full of spyware too...:-)
Carsten...you are right...Ukraine beware of American government agencies and groups bearing gifts...:-)
Miss P...Republican Mercenaries...they have plenty of those I'm sure. Multi-dimensional progressive efforts, like the Velvet Revolution Brad has in mind, etc, will be a good meeting place to start getting organized and network the issues/problems we're dealing with that can put collective people power pressure on the government.
I believe what I was also referring to earlier, in honing our message, was the thought of how we (progressives in general) not only organize, but how we convey, or market, that message to the public at large. So part of any revolution must include multiple levels of effort, including actual organization, physical meeting and communication at the local, state, and national level, mass media marketing, and strategic planning for all dimensional actions that need to be taken to achieve desired results. I hope I'm making some kind of sense...LOL!
Anyway, my back is improving after two weeks of pain here following a bad sprain/pull. That's why I've had plenty of time to make you all suffer with me! LOL )
COMMENT #55 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 5:23 pm PT...
OK, thanks Freebird. Woman likes to know the game plan.
BTW, here on the ground, in MD just outside of DC, I hear armed national guard will be at the inaugeration.
COMMENT #56 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 5:35 pm PT...
Freebird #45 - The councils are a great idea!!! Looking forward to hearing the next installment of this "planning document" - in all seriousness. Please continue.
COMMENT #57 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 6:28 pm PT...
Thanks. And yes, I am. I'll try it.
COMMENT #58 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2005 @ 6:32 pm PT...
Great to hear from you; thanks for the input.
COMMENT #59 [Permalink]
said on 1/12/2005 @ 2:40 am PT...
Peg - Hope you get this. The QUOTE button in the VR Discussion Forums will quote the particular message you are replying to.
In other words, the quoted text from that message, will appear in *your* message.
Hope that makes sense, if not, let me know!
COMMENT #60 [Permalink]
said on 1/13/2005 @ 12:08 pm PT...
The Founding Fathers were not ordinary men. They were extraordinary! They were Christians, deists, and inspired by Godly principles like liberty and other inalienable rights. The put everything on the line. Almost all of the signers of the Declaration of Independence died in poverty. They were not conspiracy theorists. The were not liberals. The Pilgrims rejected communal farms. They rejected Communism. They came here for religious freedom, not freedom from religion.
COMMENT #61 [Permalink]
said on 1/13/2005 @ 2:49 pm PT...
The Founding Fathers were NOT all Christians. And the United States was NOT intended to be a Christian country. Thomas Jefferson wrote:
I have examined all the known superstitions of the world, and I do not find in our particular superstition of Christianity one redeeming feature. They are all alike founded on fables and mythology. Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined and imprisoned. What has been the effect of this coercion? To make one half the world fools and the other half hypocrites; to support roguery and error all over the earth.
And Article 11 of the Treaty of Tripoli, drafted in 1796 (President Washington’s last year in office), passed unanimously and signed into law in 1797 by President John Adams, says:
"...the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion..."
So there's that. But let's not dwell on one solitary lie. Let's look at some of the other nonsense which our friend Paul has so graciously posted...
For example, If LIBERTY is a GODLY idea, then why is our supposedly Godly so-called president leading an administration which is so determined to keep taking away of our [former] civil liberties?
And did the Pilgrims REALLY reject communism? That's a good one! People of the 16th century rejected a concept that didn't appear until the 20th century? How did they do that, Paul? Did they have a TIME MACHINE?
The Pilgrims came here for religious freedom? Good! We finally agree on something. But religious freedom means religious freedom for EVERYBODY. Not just for fundamentalist Christians!
And if the Founding Fathers weren't conspiracy theorists, then they must have been CONSPIRACY REALISTS, because they surely recognized a conspiracy when they saw one. Their writings make this abundantly clear.
The Founding Fathers would be UTTERLY HORRIFIED by what has happened to their country, and by what their country has done to the rest of the world. And they would be appalled if they knew that their names and their memories were being abused in an attempt to justify it.
So, Paul: Why don't you go seell your horse manure somewhere else? Maybe you should try to find a less educated audience, because we have a bunch of people around here who know horse manure when we see it. And we're looking at some right now!
COMMENT #62 [Permalink]
said on 1/13/2005 @ 4:06 pm PT...
I believe they were mostly deists, who were against Christian doctrine.
COMMENT #63 [Permalink]
said on 1/13/2005 @ 4:13 pm PT...
Freedom from religion is as essential as freedom to worship God in any way one choses.
COMMENT #64 [Permalink]
said on 1/13/2005 @ 4:24 pm PT...
It is important to try to understand what a liberal really is.
It comes from the word, 'libre', which means 'free'.
They believe that individuals have the good sense to make their own choices.
They are not trying to hurt you, Paul. They are innovative and experimental, and genuinely interested in progress.
If sometimes they make mistakes, and advocate a policy that doesn't work, they think about it, debate possible solutions, and come up with a better way.
Many believe that the well-being of each citizen contributes to the strength of the whole society.
COMMENT #65 [Permalink]
said on 1/14/2005 @ 8:24 am PT...
Re: #s 60 & 61
Excellent retort to trollboy2. I wish I could see this particular quote emblazoned across every newspaper in America:
"...the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion..."
Oh, right...but it would just be discredited as a "wild, unfounded liberal conspiracy-theory" bit of fiction! I forgot...
BTW, it might be useful to point out to the troll contingent that the current, somewhat popular view of Christianity as almost synonymous with hypocrisy & hatefulness is largely due to the creepy behavior of some of the very people who tout it so loudly. Maybe if they reined in those preachers who show up at protests carrying "God Hates Fags" signs & didn't get their bloomers in a twist every time someone says "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas", we could all settle down to the serious business of prosecuting pedophile priests.
p.s. to Maxie~ You wrote:
"we voted them in,we can vote them out."
Ordinarily I would agree, but ummm.....there's this little problem we seem to be having with our voting process...
COMMENT #66 [Permalink]
said on 1/19/2005 @ 6:28 am PT...
"The Founding Fathers were not ordinary men. They were extraordinary! They were Christians, deists, and inspired by Godly principles like liberty and other inalienable rights. The put everything on the line. Almost all of the signers of the Declaration of Independence died in poverty. They were not conspiracy theorists. The were not liberals. The Pilgrims rejected communal farms. They rejected Communism. They came here for religious freedom, not freedom from religion."
Paul is not a history teacher, unless he is that new breed of creationist history teachers, (the historical corollary to the biology and evolutionary science teachers). He creates it out of thin air. One thing I will say, they all died peacefully in their own beds. That is quite a feat for revolutionaries. Fidel Castro may just emulate them on that score. How do you feel about that, Paul?
COMMENT #67 [Permalink]
said on 1/19/2005 @ 6:40 am PT...
"Peg C. Are you still having problems with your internet service? I hadn't until today and then all of a sudden either I couldn't get on or couldn't stay on the connection or go anywhere once I got on.
Called my ISP and asked if they were having problems, the answer was no, but she suggested that I go to lavasoft.de and download a free spyware program called Ad-aware SE and run it. That seemed to cure the problem. My computer was full of spyware!"
For any other folks who are having similar problems, definitely get the lavasoft ad-aware. It's free. Also, Spybot Search and Destroy, also free, and Spyware Blaster, also free. Spyware Blaster doesn't clean, it prevents the bugs from getting in and works in conjuction with Spybot Search and Destroy. Ad-aware may miss a few that Spybot S&D will catch. I use all three, they all are free, and you may manually update all of them. These are all the best of the best. Anything else you may be using might be spyware itself. And why pay for something that you can get for free. You can get a few extra features if you want to support the software and pay a license fee and register.
COMMENT #68 [Permalink]
said on 1/19/2005 @ 6:43 am PT...
And don't forget to clean out your cookies and temp internet files at least weekly, if not daily.
COMMENT #69 [Permalink]
said on 1/31/2005 @ 6:09 pm PT...
Student loan company offering student loans, Federal Student Loan consolidation, scholarship search engine, Stafford Loans and Federal PLUS Loan Applications.
COMMENT #70 [Permalink]
said on 4/1/2005 @ 1:25 am PT...
cool down we dey here keep offfffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff
COMMENT #71 [Permalink]
said on 6/23/2005 @ 11:35 am PT...
I remember too when I was living in Germany the fall of Ceaucescu in Rumania - the people effectively rid themselves of this tyrant. I think the US could have certainly been more effective erradicating Saddam Hussein by building the strength and power of the Iraqi people in overthrowing Saddam themselves. (understatement). He was an old, withering dictator and not even in the top ten of evil dictators. Now, we've destroyed generations, their history, infrastructure, and slaughtered hundreds of thousands of men, women and children. http://www.iraqbodycount.net
and America is becoming a fascist regime. The pilgrims came here for religious freedom, and for a separation of church and state, separation of corporate control. and look at the destruction of the earth environmentally. It's frightening. I only read your first blog and need to go back and see what we can do. thanks.