I was asked today on my weekly appearance on Don Grady’s Louisiana Live whether or not a sitting Vice President could be indicted. As far as I knew, the answer was yes.
Dan Froomkin of WaPo’s excellent White House Briefing has a few nuggets on precisely that…and a reminder for those old “Rule of Law” Republicans…
Not long after he killed Alexander Hamilton in their famous 1804 duel, Vice President Aaron Burr was indicted for murder in both New York and New Jersey. No constitutional crisis ensued.
And as this 2000 Department of Justice memo lays out, the department researched the issue thoroughly in 1973.
Back then, Vice President Spiro T. Agnew was trying to stave off a grand jury investigation into kickback, bribery and tax evasion charges by insisting that he was only answerable to Congress.
After all, only Congress holds the power to remove the president or vice president from office — and presumably it would be impossible to function as vice president from a jail cell.
But none other that [sic] then-solicitor general Robert Bork concluded that, while “the indictment or criminal prosecution of a sitting President would impermissibly undermine the capacity of the executive branch to perform its constitutionally assigned functions,” the vice president was fair game.
The “brief from the solicitor general argued that, while the president was immune from indictment, the vice president was not, since his conviction would not disrupt the workings of the executive branch.”
Agnew ended up resigning his office as part of a plea bargain.
Civil suits of course are another story.
Richard Keil wrote in a Bloomberg story yesterday that he had recently spoken to Ambassador Joseph Wilson, Valerie Plame’s husband, and Wilson “said that once the criminal questions are settled, he and his wife may file a civil lawsuit against Bush, Cheney and others seeking damages for the alleged harm done to Plame’s career.
“If they do so, the current state of the law makes it likely that the suit will be allowed to proceed — and Bush and Cheney will face questioning under oath — while they are in office. The reason for that is a unanimous 1997 U.S. Supreme Court decision ruling that Paula Jones’ sexual harassment suit against then- President Clinton could go forward immediately, a decision that was hailed by conservatives at the time.”
What goes around comes around, wingnuts…
The “Pits of Hell” is getting back their fugitives, be patient.
Fear not this administration, God is watching!
The United States Constitution says “We The People”, not “Bush family and friends”.
If I fear not my God, I shalt not fear this administration.
The “Pits of Hell” is getting back their fugitives, be patient.
Fear not this administration, God is watching!
The United States Constitution says “We The People”, not “Bush family and friends”.
If I fear not my God, I shalt not fear this administration.
Fear what? These two bit-wanna be fascists can answer to the PEOPLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Lets get it on!!!!!!! >8-D
LAWSUIT, LAWSUIT LAWSUIT LAWSUIT!!!!!!!!
RICO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Doug E.
A prime example of why the US is so f*cked up!
http://republicanvet.blogspot.com
Pay this a**hole a visit and let her know how you feel!
.The right is WRONG #4
Check it out – tried that website and got this:
"Don’t You Wish You Could Comment Right Now? Your IP Address Has Been Screened. Find Another And You’ll Find The Same Results."
Whoa – they’ve got me on their on their BLOCK list. How’d that happen? I don’t recall ever visiting there before, and I know I haven’t posted there – so WTF?
You want something to check out? Check out the Nazi’s who are running our country. Copy and paste.
http://www.zippyvideos.com/99229271839185.html
#5 bluebear2 –
Same thing happened to me, and I definitely have not done anything to deserve getting blocked. Is this a problem with the website, or are we really getting blocked? Anyone getting through?
The republi-nazis are coming out to roost!!!!!!
Time to kick their ass!!!!!!!!!!!! Someone get out the red-loaves, lets shove them and Diebold where the sun don’t shine!!!!!!!!!!!!
😛
Doug
Unfortunately, indicting Cheney would play right into bush’s hand. Cheney would resign in disgrace, and bush would be wide open to appoint whomever he wants for v.p. Wanna lay bets on it being Jeb? Even if its not Jeb, you can count on it being someone who would make a viable run for president in 2008 …. with VP being listed on their resume, and not enough time for them to get caught for getting into trouble like Cheney did.
Of course, it doesn’t really matter who bush appoints for VP, as elections may very well still be rigged in 2008.
Independent One #9
You’re giving Bush too much credit if you think any of this is playing into his hands. He’s a clueless moron, and his perceived leadership image has been falling apart as he stumbled through the last few months while Rove had his hands full. Cheney is the hitman, he doesn’t call the shots but carries them out. The less neocons in power, the better the nation. Let’s hope the dominos start to fall with this big clumsy aneurism-laden oaf.
To Comment #1 – I hope you are right! Because if indictments don’t come from the tough and famed Fitzgerald, nothing will stop the Bush Administration! Anyone speaking out against this administration has been hushed, propaganda is what the american people have been hearing in the national media. We preach democracy to the rest of the world, yet we don’t live in one. Thomas Jefferson said "If we ever become a goverment of 3 parties or less we will no longer be a domacracy", ooppss……………………
Yes, don’t give Bush to much credit. But don’t think he is clueless either. He is only clueless when it comes to compassion and caring for the people of this country. He is selfish not selfless as he pretends to be. He is a spoiled rotten brat, rich kid, never had to want for anything and can’t relate to the poor, elderly, needy, or minority. How could he, how could anyone who has never known any disadvantage and has been given everything he ever wanted and allowed to do anything hewanted including skipping out on his call to duty.
I’m curious how history will record this……..
We’re still after downing street again Bush….
And you still haven’t explained why you lied the entire country into war I see!!!!
How much longer is the facade going to last?
Do you know the meanings of the word RICO???? Its time……
And by the way 2008 will not be rigged if we destroy Diebold. No Diebold, no more funny business. We have to wipe them out and literally send ES&S packing to get verified paper ballots.
Just say NO: Full wide election reform, no machines.
Doug E.
{ed note: No commercial advertisements posted in comments please. Ad removed}
I won’t be happy until they get their hands off the football, I don’t trust them with that thing
Where’s our favorite shill? Why isn’t he weighing in on this? Haven’t the talking points been issued yet?
re: civil law suits – Karma has SUCH a way of coming back to bite you on the ass! Ya gotta love it.
Re: Error messages at the Republican blogspot – I’m getting it too, looks like a standard "here’s the joke" message to me.
Right Is Wrong – are you pullin our leg?
I should tell y’all that some of the addresses in here are being spoofed and used to send viruses and spam. I’ve gotten several from "blubear" (with whom I’ve never corresponded) and from Brad’s address, plus I got a bounce back to MY address from someone I never emailed, with the message that it contained an unrepairable virus.
I’ve also been put on newsletter mailing lists, and I’m always wary of opening those too (so please let me know in a personal note if you’re sending me a newsletter so I won’t filter it)
The little script kiddies like to play, so let’s be careful out there.
If Cheney can be indicted, that would explain the rumors that he plans to resign.
He gains no immunity from being a sitting vice president, and without the responsibilities of office he can devote full time to his defense. Of course, as the "new Spiro Agnew" he also forfeits the deference of the media.
Lynne Cheney has never hesitated to speak out in defense of Dick-in-the-bunker. Lately, she’s been suspiciously silent. Hmmm.
Hey y’all, there’s an article at Rawstory that says that Bush slammed Rove about his role in the leak back in 2003 .
Doesn’t that pretty much guarantee co-conspiracy charges for Bush? I mean, even if he wasn’t involved in the actual leak, if he knew who the person was, and he didn’t come forward immediately with that information, he definitely impeded the investigation.
It’s just sooo hard waiting for Fitzmas!!!
Republican Vet is actually a contributor to the Matt Margolis sites.
They are 5 heavily censored (all related)sites which pretend to have nothing to do with the RNC and White House Communications.
They are run by the same people with ties to the Administration. People they blog with are a few like minded folks who are too scared to actually blog anywhere they might be challenged… kind of like the Administration itself.
Lets not stop with Fitzmas (cute KestrelBrightEyes), there are a host of illegal activities going on with the no bid contract frenzy.
I would venture to guess that the world’s record for criminal activity by a sitting admin has been broken by the current administration.
They broke the Kyoto and other accords which recognized we all have to pull together as a planet to save it.
Instead they have blundered into alienating the world against us.
Now we have the all-time record storm season, starting with a June major hurricane, running out of names to give them, a tie or better of the count, and a threatening hurricane that in about one day went to category 5 from tropical storm. The millibar low is an all time record.
The crime spree and the storm spree are an allegory it seems. The planet and the world have spoken … and the polls show that american majorities have spoken.
Guess what you criminal bu$hit peddlers who say your shit doesn’t stink? It stinks real, real bad, and we are going to put you in a room alone with it.
(Oh … and bushy … that wasn’t God talking to you)
I don’t think a civiil suit would go very far. Bush would just classify all possible evidence as "top secret" . Voila! No case to try.
Dredd re: #23 – Or maybe it’s just like Jon Stewart said, when Bush arrived in Nashville on Earth Day – the skies clouded up and the wind kicked in, then as soon as he left, it started clearing up.
Jon Stewart commented "That’s because the EARTH HATES HIM SOOOO MUCH!!" *L*
BTW, I wish I could take credit, but I didn’t coin the word "Fitzmas" (but don’t you just LOVE it??) I read it somewhere – on a diary on DailyKos I think.
To #4, I paid a visit and now I’m banned. What pussies those rightwing nuts are…I did not curse, just spoke truth, shame on their murdering criminal supporting asses.
#19 KestrelBrighteyes said
"I should tell y’all that some of the addresses in here are being spoofed and used to send viruses and spam. I’ve gotten several from "blubear" (with whom I’ve never corresponded) and from Brad’s address,…"
The blubear you refer to is me – About a month ago I began receiving email claiming to come from bradblog which contained a virus at my home computer. Upon examination of the routing and a back trace it appeared to come from China, however the whois info for the originating url was not available or blocked.
Over the years I have replied back to many "senders" of viruses, but it always seems that the addresses were spoofed. Many of the people replied that they ran virus scans and found nothing.
I also ran a scan on my computer when the emails from bradblg started coming in and it checked out clean.
What was interesting is that I don’t recall contacting brad or anyone else here from my home computer, although I have wrote to brad and several others from work. My home address had only been posted here for 1 or 2 weeks prior to the infected mail since it is a new address. No infected mail came to my work address.
Makes me think it was more than random chance.
I have received one email from Sue, but it seemed legitimate and was not infected.
Stanley Hilton, Bob Dole’s former chief of staff, had a
$7 billion lawsuit against the Bushcists filed on behalf
of the US taxpayers. It was thrown out of federal
court last spring not for lack of merit but on the
doctrine of "sovereign immunity"–the concept that a
sitting President can not be sued.
How the court squared this notion with the fact that the
sexual harrassment suit went forward against Clinton
under the idea that "no one, not even a sitting President,
if above the law."
I guess the sex laws are more important than those
governing the deaths of innocent civilians in illegal
wars?
I’m in Florida & right now we’re watching to see what Hurricane Wilma’s gonna do.
In the next few days people will again have to decide:
Do we put up the hurricane shutters? Lay in a supply of batteries, water, candles, non-perishable food? Or will we be "lucky" again & not be hit directly? Are authorities exaggerating the danger because they want to be on the safe side? All the questions we always ask.
A friend sent me a horrible commentary on the New Orleans disaster, purportedly by George Carlin, saying some things we’ve heard before:
"you were told to get out"
"it’s your own fault"
"the government owes you nothing"
"stop looting, assholes!" etcera, etcetera…
I have a couple of points here. One is that there will be people here who will bank on again being "lucky", will not put up shutters, not evacuate, not prepare.
Foolish? Perhaps. But if my neighborhood is one day underwater & people are stranded on their rooftops for a week without food & water, watching bodies float down the street, I wouldn’t point at them & let them rot & die because they were guilty of being foolish. I dunno, call me crazy but I kind of think the punishment should fit the crime.
So my second point is:
Letting our own citizens rot & die in New Orleans seems to fall rather neatly under the heading Negligent Homicide. Aren’t people normally arrested & jailed for that?
Why haven’t Bush, Cheney, Rice, "Brownie" & Chertoff been charged with this crime which they obviously committed?
All the death & destruction in Iraq can be covered with the blanket of our "being at war"; all the cuts to domestic programs & the tax cuts for the rich, all the decimating of the economy & the environment, all the propaganda, all the scandals, all the cronyism, all the investigations, all of it is covered with a gigantic, tangled, complicated pile of horseshit known as "business as usual";
But New Orleans is different. It happened here, right before our eyes. We watched as every day went by and the "cavalry" didn’t come; we read all the reports of food being turned away, water & fuel being turned away, hospital beds & doctors & medicine & generators being turned away, people & companies & countries offering to help being turned away.
They let them die. They fucking CHOSE to let them die.
There is some current buzz about Cheney possibly resigning because a sitting vp can be indicted. And also some buzz about the fact that a sitting president is not immune from a civil lawsuit, as per Clinton/Paula Jones. I dunno, something about even a president not being "above the law".
Is there a lawyer out there who can bring a civil suit against bush et al for negligent homicide?
When you kill hundreds of your own people through incompetence, cronyism appointments & neglect, it seems to me THERE OUGHT TO BE A FUCKING CONSEQUENCE.
Here is a pretty comprhensive analysis of how to procecute this bunch, without the possibility of pardons being handed out–all around.
http://citizenspook.blogspot.co...itutional.html
Hey Brad,
Thanks for that post.
You know, I first joined this blog last December when Randi Rhodes broke your story of fraud in last year’s elections.
At the time, I was depressed like nearly every other progressive.
You know what Brad? Things are totally the opposite now, 10 months later. Who would have ever thought any of this would be happening… at all… let alone so soon after the election (when the neocons are supposed to be at the zenith of their power.)
In January 2004, when I returned from my most recent trip to Brazil, I decided that it was time for me to become an activist; that I had taken too much of the neocons’ bulls–t since late 2000.
But never in my wildest dreams did I think we would be seeing the possibility of indicting the Veep… and that he may be resigning soon (according to US News and World Report).
It makes me feel…. RELIEVED… it makes me feel… VINDICATED.
I will not stop the activism until Bush himself is frog marched out of the Oval Office. And until the neocons in both parties are voted out of office in Congress.
But I can tell you I sure am feeling much better today than only 10 months ago.
MrBlueSky #31
I share your feelings. Bradblog has been a daily high point for me since I first discovered it last fall.
Roy #30
I read it. Not gonna happen … remember that the pardon of Nixon had an impeachment nexus too …
Mr. Blue Sky #31
A resignation by Cheney will not protect him from an indictment.
And to everyone … watch out that your hopes do not get too high yet … stay cool. Be patient …
Waiting for this to break at Raw Story:
Second aide assisting leak prosecutor,
those close to case say… Developing…
I totally PRAY and if there is a God, and ANY JUSTICE LEFT IN AMERICA, which I doubt, but I pray and if Fitzgerald and/or grand jury has ANY balls at all and if Fitzgerald is NOT covering up for them, THEY SHOULD BE INDICTED AND IMPEACHED AND IMPRISONED AND FROG MARCHED OUT OF WHITE HOUSE IN LEG IRONS AND CUFFS, TOO! NOONE SHOULD BE ABOVE THE LAW NOONE! I WISHED LIKE HELL I WAS ON GRAND JURY! By the way, If they do get indicted, does same jury sit in on trial? Or not? PRAY PEOPLE THAT THERE IS STILL SOME JUSTICE IN AMERICA AND THAT BUSH, CHENEY AND 21 OTHERS GET INDICTED AND NOW! AND NO DAMN DEALS EITHER AND PROTECT THE GUY TELLING ON THEM, BUT WHO KNOWS HE MAYBE JUST STEERING FITGERALD IN WRONG DIRECTION? AWAY FROM CHENEY,ETC. AND IF CHENEY RESIGNS, BIG DAMN DEAL! HE PROBABLY WANTS TO ANYWAY, BECAUSE OF HEALTH REASONS, AND IS TRYING TO SAVE HIS GODDAMN PENSION THEY GET! WHICH SHOULD BE TAKEN AWAY, IF INDICTED! THEY NEED TO BE IN ORANGE SUITS AND LEG IRONS AND CUFFS AND NOW! GUILTY AS SIN OVER THIS AND LYING TO CONGRESS AND PEOPLE ABOUT WARS, AND ALSO INVOLVEMENT IN 9-11, TOO! I PRAY FITGERALD PUTS NATION ABOVE PARTY AND INDICTS THE BASTARDS! I AM AFRAID WHAT AHOLES MIGHT DO IF INDICTED?! LET U.S. TROOPS GO TO WHITE HOUSE AND GET THEM OUT! WITH CUFFS,ETC. THAT IS WHAT THEY DESERVE AND TO BE HANGED FOR TREASON OVER OUTING OF CIA AGENT, 9-11 INVOLVEMENT, AND LYING ABOUT WAR, AND HAVE THEM PAY BACK $$ FROM ILL GOTTEN WAR PROFITEERING,TOO!
#30
Roy,
Re your link…so it all hinges on them being impeached & convicted. If that happens, THEN, if I’m understanding this correctly, they couldn’t issue pardons. Though I’m not sure what, exactly, "flowing from impeachment" means, in a legal sense.
Three unconnected items:
1. Lynne Cheney was all over the tv networks yesterday.
2. I heard on tv that congress is contemplating removing the food stamp program for the poor in order to lower the budget.
3. Somewhere I read yesterday that Tony Blair has committed to "The Carlyle Group" upon his leaving office.
Sue #35
You asked "If they do get indicted, does same jury sit in on trial?
No, it is called a petite jury. The grand jury is typically more than 12 people, and does not require a unanimous vote, however the petite or trial jury is 12 people and a unanimous vote is required to convict.
This is cute y’all.
Tips For Dealing With Fitzmas
The Right is Wrong #4
Evidently it worked. I went over there to offer some constructive criticism, but the page says:
Due To High Traffic Volume, Republican Vet Is Currently Unavailable. Check Back At A Later Time To Access This Amazing Site Which Has Attracted An Overwhelming Liberal Obsession. While All Comments Are Welcome, Liberal Trolls Who Fail To Identify Themselves, Fail To Read And Comprehend, Fail To Follow Instructions Or Simply Come To Prove RV’s Point About Liberal Ignorance And Immaturity Will Be Deleted. Constructive Comments Only Are Needed. All Others Will Not Be Tolerated And Will Be Dismissed, As The Source Will Be Considered.
What is Fitzma?
Roy 30, Send that info to Fitzgerald! Hopefully he will use info to make sure NOONE is pardoned,either! He HAD BETTER INDICT BUSH AND CHENEY TOO, ALONG WITH REST OF AHOLES! Because person was right if Bush gave Rove hell over outing,(which I seriously doubt, if any he ordered him to do it) than that proves Bush knew about it and didn’t come forward then! PLus, George Stenopolis said Bush,Cheney knew! There will probably be a cover-up as USUSAL, in cases like these! Does Fitzgerald have to answer to AG Gonzales? He shouldn’t have too! IF he doesn’t indict Bush and CHeney and others and they don’t get convicted, WE NEED TO RIOT IN THE STREETS AND NOW! NO GODDAMN JUSTICE ANY MORE IN U.S. ONLY WHAT YOU CAN BUY! AND TWO SETS ONE FOR POOR, MIDDLE CLASS, AND ONE FOR RICH AND POWERFUL!
Sue – "Fitzmas" is a play on "Christmas", it’ll be when Patrick Fitzgerald hands down indictments in his Treasongate investigation.
The grand jury expires Oct 28, so we KNOW it’ll be before then.
That link up top now says "too much traffic on site"
And, you can’t sue the "government".. it has "sovergein immunity" which means you can’t sue them for "doing their job".. A "person" is not the Government.. That is, Shrubby is "the commander in cheif" and "president", you can’t sue him (for damages) for things he did "in the name of government" while executing his position’s requirements.. But, lying and obstructing justice isn’t part of his job description.
You can’t sue him for the deaths of the troops, but for the troops (and the rest of us), you can sue him for the lying/obstruction used to get them killed…
At 5pm, following news of indictments of Rove, Libby, or Cheney, I declare a national day of gratitude in your nearest watering hole.
Pass it on.
David Corn is reporting (davidcorn.com) that former Congressman Dick Gephardt is saying he now believes going into Iraq was a mistake and that he should never have trusted the Bush people. I wonder if Gephardt will now apologize for screwing the campaign of Gov. Dean (who was anti-war from the gitgo).
Wayne Madsen has many interesting things to report (waynemadsenreport.com) and tucked neatly in the middle was this tidbit:
"Plame and Brewster Jennings & Associates’ most critical overseas work on WMD counter proliferation occurred between 1996 and 2003. U.S. intelligence sources also confirm that during this period, the CIA counter-WMD team discovered the involvement of neo-con elements in the Bush administration, closely tied to the Likud regime in Israel and the Russian-Ukrainian-Israeli Mafia (RUIM), in trafficking nuclear components to Pakistan and Iran in order to heighten tensions between the West and Islamic states with developmental and embryonic nuclear weapons programs."
WOW! If that can be proved in court then the whole NeoCon movement will become NeoConvicted for treason and some very very high crimes.
Sue #42
If I am reading this particular article http://citizenspook.blogspot.co...-generals.html of "Citizenspook’s" correctly, then no, he does not have to answer to Gonzales.
I suspect a major something??? will happen and soon, caused by bushco. Which will take ALL eyes off Fitzgerald’s activities and all hope of hanging these bastards high will fade or diasappear–for a time anyway. Eventually though, somewhere down the road they will have their asses nailed to the wall.
I am hanging onto hope for Fitzma until–ALL HOPE IS GONE–however.
http://citizenspook.blogspot.co...-generals.html
Timing is everything, Iraq Constitution, Hussein on trial and Hurricane Wilma, as we wait for GJ findings (shades of Delay indictment). Darn sounds like August-Sept. Rove is in an undisclosed location and I doubt he is sharing the bunker with cheney. Cheney is dying literally and figuratively, bush scolded rove, (the spin begins to save bush..don’t even believe that one), who will be the next vp. Ohmigod, I am so glad I got here in time for all of this. While I read about Hussein, the thought crossed my mind….what would bush say. I am still the President! Even though he has deliberately inflicted death on thousands, used chemical weapons (DU), used our kids as cannon fodder, robbed our country of it’s wealth for his friends. They are of the same cloth IMO. M4
Joan, It WASN’T incompetence on their part in failure for Katrina relief BUT DONE ON PURPOSE! WAKE THE HELL UP PEOPLE! THESE PEOPLE INCLUDING BUSH DO NOTHING, I REPEAT NOTHING THAT IS NOT PLANNED TO FURTHER THEIR SICK AGENDA’S! Hence, Now he wants to be able to call out Guard on OWN people in cases of natural disasters, or bird flu! See a pattern here, anyone? Get a clue! He murdered those people and it was on purpose to say, see I need more power to call out Guard! Wake the Hell up Sheep! Bush is NOT a moron, like I and many others once thought! WE ARE THE MORONS FOR PUTTING UP WITH HIS/THEIR ASSES FOR SOO LONG! I believe it is a put on by Bush to act dumb to get people’s sympathy so NOONE takes him serious, while he TOTALLY gets his own way! He is NOT a moron, WE ARE for putting up with his/their asses for sooo very long, without demanding impeachment,etc. Trust me, NOTHING They do is without planning and to further their evil, agenda’s! Pray Fitzgerald indicts them ALL including the insane, murdering, EVIL PNAC group ALL of them, so they disband and are in prison, then convict them ALL and imprison them. But that is too damn good for them! They should be made to pay back $$ to U.S. Treasury that they stoled through Halliburton,etc. and then sent to Gitmo! Or to N.O. with water up to their necks and gators too and no food, no water and no help! NOW, THAT WOULD BE TRUE JUSTICE AND TO HAVE U.S. TROOPS FROG MARCH THEIR ASSES OUT OF WHITE HOUSE AND RUMMIE FROM PENTAGON TOO! In cuffs and leg irons too!
Oh MAN this is funny – we even have FITZMAS CAROLS!!!
cut and paste:
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2...0/19/103211/60
Yeah, yeah, I know, we shouldn’t get our hopes up.
Still, it’s fun to dream, isn’t it?
(Besides, I was stuck inside keeping a watch on an ebay item for my kid, what the hell else am I gonna do?)
More Fitzmas carols:
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2...0/19/93035/600
#49 I agree, we believed the moron bs. Bush is a phycopath and a pretender. Pretends he doesn’t know anything, ever, ie: New Orleans. I forgot to mention that deliberate genocide in my earlier post. I hope everyone involved in the coup perpetuated on the USA by bushco and his ‘republican guard’ go down. Gitmo is too nice for those evildoers. We need to use the AG’s interpretation of information gathering to get them to confess in one of their own privately owned prisons in our own country, televised by MSM. Real Reality TV.
Indict Bush too! I think Cheney WANTS to resign due to poor health! This might just be a ruse on part of Fitzgerald to look tough but not really being tough! Indict Cheney, nothing happens, he resigns REALLY because of bad health(the ahole CAN’T have heart problems, as he doesn’t have a HEART!) and Fitzgerald looks like he did something when he REALLY DIDN’T! I don’t trust PF, he is a R after all! He and others needs to put our nation above party! And that includes braindead Bush supporter’s who haven’t gotten a clue yet and are stupid and still support the aholes! George Stenolpois said Bush and Cheney were involved SO indict and CONVICT THEM TOO! It’s NOT good enough to be indicted, THEY ALL NEED TO BE CONVICTED AND HANGED FOR TREASON, OVER CIA OUTING, 9-11 INVOLVEMENT, AND LYING TO TAKE US TO ILLEGAL, IMMORAL WARS!
We are living in extraordinary times. This administration had the gall to believe the american people would blindly follow their instructions. Their illeagle and immoral instructions.
We collectively have said, Hell No!
The pressure is on these criminals that have done their danmdest to spoil our beautiful country. No quarter will be given these cretins, these bloated arrogant pretenders.
The voices that have joined here have one strengthening thread tying them all together as one;
Give Us Back Our Country!
#49 Sue,
He murdered those people and it was on purpose to say, see I need more power to call out Guard! Wake the Hell up Sheep!
I think that maybe you’re taking this a little to far. The national guard is typically used by governors to respond to national disasters. If they can’t use them, and shouldn’t have used them in NO, what is your alternative?
And Sue, no doubt, Bush IS a moron.
Well, I just went to the Wayne Madsen site (#46), lead me to Tom Flocco, led me to Antichamber, led me to Financial Terrorism, Bonus 3392-181, Brady Bonds. I have spent some time on these sites as my inquiring mind wants to know………I will spend some more, take what I need and leave the rest. The information I have read so far is so beyond evil, a GJ indictment of any of bushco pales in comparison. I also still believe this is a Weather War, not just an unusally active hurricane season. M4 (who is not laughing today)
MarkF – As I’ve warned many times, be careful of info coming from Madsen. I don’t have much confidence in his credibility. For good reasons.
Sue,
I’m kind of following you there on the skeptic path about
our buddy Fitz. The last couple days I’ve actually been
wondering why we haven’t seen the Bush/Rove spin and
destroy machine racheted up to take down Fitz like they
do everyone else.
It just seems a little odd that they have not been able
to launch an discrediting effort on him. Instead everyone
is playing up what a straightshooter he is. I’m hoping
that there will be a way to push all of this even if he
of his own accord doesn’t push it with an indictment.
Hold your breath!!
Onward!
On another note. Please remember that Mohammad Atta was on the SunCruz casino four times before 9/11, the same deal Abromoff is being indicted on for money fraud, the same one the owner was killed gang style by two people recently charged with the murder, who just happened to get paid $250000 by Abromoffs company…
Why was Mohammad Atta on this boat 4 times??? Do muslims gamble??? Why that casino???
What else did the owner that was killed know?? Anything?? Seems a little fishy to me… or a the very very very least odd.
Feedback?
Charlie New Orleans
I trust Wayne Madsen & Citizen Spook….they are former spooks in the intelligence community and are rarely ever wrong.
Anyway….turns out Fitzgerald’s team is extending the Grand Jury. That means only one thing…….they’re going after the entire enchilada, and that includes the treasonous war and any plotting the Likud monsters did SUE
You can be rest assured…..that the monsters who basically destroyed our country, and used Bush, will BE brought to justice…..Remember Sibel Edmonds and Able Danger…..Its all coming raining down.
Doug E.
Charlie: I’ve been following it like glue but if I told you the Likud Zionists were responsible for 9/11 and not Muslims of Allah, you’d not believe me….it would be too much to know that the Al-Quaeda wasn’t real, and was hired by them to stage the attacks for the purpose of a new order……but that is exactly what happened.
Doug E.
Doug, #60
What about the 29 million dollar check from Five Star Trust Madsen wrote about? Was he wrong about that?
BVAC: To my knowledge that was not wrong but misleading evidence. The check was forged by CIA, connected back to Election Fraud. That money was really coming from Thomas Noe’s gross amount of funds. Look up the Workers Compensation Fund.
Noe paid for nearly every office-branch in Ohio even Governor Taft’s "selections" and was the $100,000 big time fundraiser that contributed to fraud. He met with Rove etc. two days before the irregularities.
And he was not working with any CIA, the man worked virtually alone to launder money through the boards of election. So the CIA check was a way to throw in a blind mouse, and if you look at the history it was tied to Billionaires for Bush which is the Five Trust scandal New York is tracking the money back into.
Doug E.
Doug, #63
Sounds interesting. Is this tied into ‘coingate’ and what other investigations touch upon this? Can you source the CIA-forgery?
A quick perusal of the blogs doesn’t bring up any information about Fitzy extending the grand jury, where did you hear that? And suppose he doesn’t go after the whole enchilada, what then?
Doug,
I beleive every snicket of what you say, after all our talking points are the ones that have been credible and brought exposer to these stories. Never mind my own personal research on 9/11 leads me to beleive our own government at the very least allowed it to happen, but with evidence like Atta being on Abromoffs casino, suggests that they were involved, and perhaps even planned the whole damn thing themselves.
I would beleive it Doug.
Charie
bvac #64
I tried a search on Fitz extending the GJ. Came up with lots of articles saying he might do so, but nothing saying he actualy had.
You have anything on that Doug?
While searching I came up with this from Huffington Post: Plamegate: The Next Step
I sure can’t wait! Isn’t that the wrong finger though?
Bluebear & BVAC: It was announced today on television, and I did not witness the conference. Sanborn basically said they were extending the Grand Jury.
The investigation will not be "completed until all loose ends are tied up."
Also BVAC: The source for the CIA forgery is on Wayne Madsen’s site. It was forged by a clever CIA individual who might be tied to Abramoff. Abramoff has been known to slip in misleading information before especially to protect his buddies, until they caught him.
Thomas Noe of Coingate fame is involved in the scandal and the FBI found evidence of his wife rigging "the elections" in just Lucas County alone. Look up Madsen’s past articles and also check out Cleveland Plain Dealer, it hits the bullseye on the entire thing.
Doug E.
Here is one,
Election fraud scandal
If you follow those links backwards you can see the images of the "check" that was supposed to pay. It was a forgery, according to intelligence experts. And was used to deflect attention and move soft-money through other means…..basically through the workers compensation funds.
Doug E.
blow me and I’ll turn into a flame(it’s a slavic thing you wouldnt understand)
Sue,
Jeez, woman, play nice. And quit calling us ‘sheep’! It’s rude!
Everyone here, except a few trolls, knows bush is a moron.
Whether NO was cold, calculated, deliberate murder or unconscionable, unforgivable incompetence I can’t say for certain, not having that kind of access into their black & shriveled little hearts.
But I think it’s moot. Either way, their actions/inaction led to the deaths of hundreds if not thousands (no reason I can see to believe any official body count) of their own citizens & if our criminal justice system does not address this obvious CRIME then we will know it, too, is a lie, along with our "non-partisan" supreme court, checks & balances, & all that bull about "of the people, by the people, for the people".
Mark Fiore’s latest flash animation "Hurricane Anything".
Doug said in re: the $29 million check (which only matters to folks who know what that’s in reference to)
"BVAC: To my knowledge that was not wrong but misleading evidence."
No. It was wrong.
I’ve quietly given my warnings a coupla times, and I try to do it quietly, cuz I don’t like to smash up folks who don’t out and out deserve it. But there are benchmarks of good and responsible and credible journalism. And unfortunately, the sources you mention, Doug, don’t meet up to them.
I’m saying this to you with very first hand knowledge. Regretably. I just hate to see folks led unnecessarily astray.
Get the traitors of Traitorgate
There were 3 people allowed to ask questions at Cynthia McKinny’s hearing on 9/11. Wayne Madsen was one of them. Another subject…NO was genocide because corperations like wal mart and volunteers were not allowed into NO for days while people died on their roof tops and attics. It’s evident from just paying attention to MSM. Hard to take genocide under the nose. Makes me sympathetic to the average German under Hitler.
Since we are still trying to recover from that asshole "Slick Willie" , who gives a ratsass about indicting Bush……granted Bush is no Ronald Raegan (the greatest presidenr ever) but he is a God compared to the national disgrace of a human being called Clinton, a liar and a criminal, so just get over it…you cant and wont do anything about Bush..except maybe run your mouth which is your right……SUPPERT OUR SOLDIERS…