READER COMMENTS ON
"Tribune Media: MSM Failed to Note 'Hackable Diebold Red Flags' in New Hampshire Primary Results"
(32 Responses so far...)
COMMENT #1 [Permalink]
said on 1/9/2008 @ 4:43 pm PT...
BRAD, PLEASE SEND THIS TO COUNTDOWN@MSNBC. WHEN I SEND ONE OF YOUR PIECES TO HIM THEY GO TO ANOTHER ADDRESS. THIS IS THE BEST NEWS I'VE HEARD TODAY. THANK YOU BRAD !
COMMENT #2 [Permalink]
said on 1/9/2008 @ 4:47 pm PT...
While the idea of hacking a primary election ballot seems attractive, the EXIT polls that I read seem to bear out the election results. Two factors played a huge roll: (1) reportedly neo-conservative groups have been urging their folks to say they are voting for Obama to either discredit him at the polls or in an effort to herd people to vote for him, as reported on several websites; (2) women turned out in far greater numbers than men, and voted for Clinton. The crack in her veneer the other day really rallied women to support her.
I recommend that you rely less on pre-election polls and look at exit polls. It was the Florida exit polls in 2000 that were the real sign of election fraud there.
COMMENT #3 [Permalink]
said on 1/9/2008 @ 4:51 pm PT...
M Holt -
And which Exit Polls would those be? The ones adjusted to match the election results? (The only ones that are publicly available, to my knowledge).
If you happen to get access to the RAW, pre-adjusted data, please let us know. Until then, all we're asking for is some transparency here. Pretty please?
If all is well, there should be no problem in actually counting those ballots so we can actually know that without having to resort to "faith-based" voting. Again.
COMMENT #4 [Permalink]
said on 1/9/2008 @ 5:11 pm PT...
Did you hear Matthews on Hardball report on the raw exit poll data? He just said that he was shown the raw data at 5:30 last night and it showed Obama with a "substantial victory" and matched the earlier polls.
He gave that info because he wanted to figure out why people lied to the exit pollsters.
COMMENT #5 [Permalink]
said on 1/9/2008 @ 5:27 pm PT...
Robert Koehler is GREAT!
COMMENT #6 [Permalink]
Jackie, Baton Rouge
said on 1/9/2008 @ 5:47 pm PT...
Now, this makes more sense to me. Could not understand how Sen. Obama had record crowds, spoke until he lost his voice, had the Iowa win (bounce),almost single handedly responsible for the youth vote, and had record turn-out; but, lost the election. Something just was not right. I truly believe there is a Clinton connection to Diebold. This clearly explains the "come back kid" factor. My mother always told me, "IF YOU LIE, YOU WILL STEAL", and we all know Bill and Hillary are notorious liars. So, why can't we ban these machines from further use?
COMMENT #7 [Permalink]
said on 1/9/2008 @ 5:54 pm PT...
This photo says a lot, when combined with her statement that the Iraq war will be have to be "ended properly".
She was not concerned with "starting it properly", so since the military industrial complex is funding her, the "surprise win" is understandable.
It is the:
Rubin Carter was falsely tried.
The crime was murder "one," guess who testified?
Bello and Bradley and they both baldly lied
And the newspapers, they all went along for the ride.
How can the life of such a man
Be in the palm of some fool's hand?
To see him obviously framed
Couldn't help but make me feel ashamed to live in a land
Where justice is a game.
(story of the hurricane), including but not limited to, Katrina, which is emerging. The MSM does not get it do they?
In Amurka, "you are doin a heckuva job EVM's" is an absolute. In Amurka, forget questioning the machine, question the integrity of voters instead.
Like Paul Simon said, "They have all gone to look for America", but I can't seem to get past Big Brother's Amurkan MSM. Can You?
COMMENT #8 [Permalink]
said on 1/9/2008 @ 5:55 pm PT...
Stu Rothenberg on public television, in my opinion, doubted the results also. He mentioned that late deciders broke evenly which means that all polls were all wrong about the Dems before the last 36 hours or something else is going on.
COMMENT #9 [Permalink]
said on 1/9/2008 @ 5:55 pm PT...
The MSM has it's troubles, and so do mainstream progressive sites online. Take MoveOn, for instance. They sent out a pitch for paper ballots today with a twisted reference to New Hampshire. MoveOn apparently doesn't get it that, even where there is paper, if that paper goes uncounted, we will rely on Big Media (untransparent Exit Polls)to tell us who wins our elections.
Here's my open letter to MoveOn:
In today's petition drive for paper ballots, you raise the following question:
"Imagine if yesterday's New Hampshire primary had been decided by insecure electronic voting machines instead of paper ballots. With polls saying one thing and ballots another—and a thin margin deciding the winner—the results could be forever in doubt."
Please explain how yesterday's primary was determined by paper ballots? For 81% of the precincts, the paper was fed into Diebold optical scan technology that is notoriously insecure. There was no manual recount or audit, so New Hampshire is no better off than Georgia, Maryland or any number of other paperless jurisdictions.
Why wasn't there a call for a manual recount or audit in NewHampshire? The answer to that is easy, isn't it? There was no call for a manual recount or audit because the (publicly released) media exitpolls substantiated the electronic results.
In other words, we don't need paper after all--we'll just continue to let the media tell us who won.
The problem is, if there's one thing less transparent and more poisonous to democracy than a Diebold electronic voting machine it's CNN/NBC/CBS/ABC/PBS/AP/NYTimes/WashingtonPost.
I'm sorry MoveOn, but shifting the vote counting from Diebold to Big Media is NOT a step in the direction of legitimate elections.
COMMENT #10 [Permalink]
Grizzly Bear Dancer
said on 1/9/2008 @ 5:56 pm PT...
2004/2006: US elections run on diebold computer voting systems are proven to be inaccurate, hackable, and used to altered election results.
2008 OUTCOME: Thes same voting company with ties to the elected criminals who stole the previous elections are allowed to count the votes in secrecy and even use the same hackable machines. Results are then parroted by the corporate mass media. Sort of makes me want to enlist in bush/cheney's military force to take control of the Iraqi oil reserves i mean spread our form of democracy to Iraq and around the world.
Pathetic treasonous 1%er liers who have infiltrated all 3 branches of government and own and operate the corporate mass media now will completely stay the coarse until everything on this planet is either destroyed or killed off through careless mismanagement.
Don't worry about anyone with ties to the terrorist bush/cheney crime family liers who sells nuclear secrets to Pakistan and others countries for cash deals because they are taken care of and they are completely insulated from conviction of any and all wrongdoing.
7% of a population can create a movement and it's not about us and them. Don't ever forget it's all about us..we the people and what we want. Elected representative have the priviledge to serve us.
COMMENT #11 [Permalink]
said on 1/9/2008 @ 6:14 pm PT...
Each campaign will have a computer-nerd department and send out "repair men" every election eve. They'll have to line up and take a number. In a couple hundred years, the practice will have twisted into mythology, and children will believe that Saint Electionus comes in the middle of the night and leaves cookies on the chips implanted in their heads.
COMMENT #12 [Permalink]
mary ann ford
said on 1/9/2008 @ 6:14 pm PT...
Brad, thank you for keeping on this. The blogs I frequent have not picked up on this yet. I wonder if people even realize the Diebold machines are being used in primaries. Over and over tonight shows are discussing how nine polls could be so wrong specifically for the Dems, but spot on for the Repubs. They aren't even considering the optical scanners could be a problem - again. Is this why the Dems in power haven't responded to concerns about the machines, because they hoped to use them to their advantage some day?
COMMENT #13 [Permalink]
said on 1/9/2008 @ 6:23 pm PT...
Our world faces a crisis as yet unperceived by those possessing the power to make great decisions for good and evil. The unleashed power of the atom has changed everything save our modes of thinking, and thus we drift toward unparalleled catastrophe.
(Albert Einstein, emphasis added). The word "drift" should be replaced with "rush headlong" (sounds like the EVM version of rush limbaugh?).
Amurka is addicted to oil and election catastrophe but is mac is back "luvin it".
It might be fitting to ask if there is a 10 step program for correcting that addiction.
And it might be noted that if fair democratic elections was once one of the ten, that is no longer the case in Amurka.
COMMENT #14 [Permalink]
said on 1/9/2008 @ 7:18 pm PT...
ahhh shut up...
Ever stop to think that Hillary won the NH debates fair and square? the repubs. that want Hillary to run are dillusional, Bill Clinton helped rally the troops, Clinton always wins NH, People like Hillary more than the fairy tale of O.
And IF the Hillary rigged the vote?--ha ha a concept so stupid its hard to even type that..as far as I'm concerned sounds like a good plan...anything to put the dems in power.
Brad you sound like a weasel on Malloy---Hillary is da bomb--get over it.
COMMENT #15 [Permalink]
said on 1/9/2008 @ 7:22 pm PT...
Another bullshit election. How can Obama or Edwards talk about fighting for change when they can't fight for their own primary election?
Will we see another Ohio 2004 or Florida 2000 where the candidate bends and subcombs to political pressure?
More and more people understand how these machines can't be trusted. Why don't the candidates?
Call these candidates and let them know your want a true street fighter, who will restore the constitution, not a whimp who will lead us through the primary and election and then walk away.
COMMENT #16 [Permalink]
said on 1/9/2008 @ 8:02 pm PT...
I know for a fact that MSNBC knew at 5:30 the exits had Obama up 10% and that they thought that with their latest round from the late exit polls he would be up around 15%. Thanks for keeping on this.
COMMENT #17 [Permalink]
said on 1/9/2008 @ 8:18 pm PT...
COMMENT #18 [Permalink]
said on 1/9/2008 @ 8:24 pm PT...
They stole votes from Ron Paul folks. He won 3rd and Diebold put him in 5th. Obama beat Hillary, no question. This is an outrage!!!
I will not have my future shaped by these lying HACKS!!!!!!!!!!!
COMMENT #19 [Permalink]
said on 1/9/2008 @ 8:31 pm PT...
Jayzus, I can't believe we're still fighting this battle!
COMMENT #20 [Permalink]
said on 1/9/2008 @ 8:59 pm PT...
Ever stop to think that Hillary won the NH debates fair and square?...Brad you sound like a weasel on Malloy---Hillary is da bomb--get over it.
Get over what? And yeah, Hillary may well have "won the NH debates fair and square."
So what evidence do we have to prove it one way or another, SS? Just asking. And thanks for stopping by.
COMMENT #21 [Permalink]
Jeannie Dean in FL-13
said on 1/9/2008 @ 9:13 pm PT...
Brad, you really are doing the best, most important journalism of your life here, this week. Can't tell you how much I've relied on BRADBLOG for my morning info-hurl/ been linking to and from you non-stop for two days, bleary eyed, alternating between being too coffee-full or Over-Stolied.
Good God. What a week.
GademVote (#9)...! I'm SO glad you mentioned MOVEON.ORG's silliness! Great letter to them, by the way, but I don't think they read anything...ever. I swear, the MOVEON.ORG staff must be eight mutes working out of a closet full of sand and booze and Narnia, because as a SARASOTA COUNTY VOTER I have written them a gabillion letters on this subject and they never responded/ put out VERY LITTLE INFO to their membership, and when they did it was all wrong/ backwards/ pro-HOLT/ stupid, stupid, stupid.
In fact, EVERY TIME they send me a ridiculous 'action-spam' that starts: Hey, Jeannie Dean--TODAY Congress votes on appropriations for the war...sign this petitiion and CALL AND YOUR REP. VERN BUCHANAN and TELL HIM HOW YOU FEEL..." (???) it gives me a scorching case of 'E.I.-itis'. I always write back something like:
Dear Move On: Please stop telling me to contact my UNELECTED REPRESENTATIVE now seated, CONDITIONALLY, in the House to urge him to vote this way or that. I know how he will vote, and his choices DO NOT REFLECT THE WILL OF THE VOTERS IN THIS DISTRICT...ELI and NOAH and the rest of MOVEON.ORG staff--until you address the issue of Sarasota's 18,412 missing votes for Congress from ES&S's iVotronic machines, nothing else you are working on matters one iota. Your efforts are moot. THE VOTE IS ALL/ PLEASE REPORT AND ADDRESS THIS CRITICAL ISSUE."...
blah, blah, blah.
Wow--just watched ZOGBY play the awkward apologist on STEWART, sweating, back-peddling and basically admitting that they just don't know what happened.
I think I just witnessed the nail in the coffin of ELECTION POLLING...I feel a slight sick coming up.
Very glad, at least, that BRAD FRIEDMAN's name is prominently featured in this piece, framed with due respect as "election watchdog"...FINALLY, some proper props.
Way to go, Brad. You're a Great Man.
COMMENT #22 [Permalink]
Jackie, Baton Rouge
said on 1/9/2008 @ 9:18 pm PT...
How much would a physical recount cost? Throw those Deibold readers away. I'm certain THOUSANDS of people would donate to put this issue to rest. I certainly would. Recount now before they destroy the ballots. Tell me were to send my donation for the recount of the democratic NH primary 2008.
Add this one to the Clinton's list of "gates". "Voter Fraudgate", he should have left well enough alone, but no, he had to make her the "COME BACK GAL". The president of Deibold has to be one of President Clinton's buddy from his drug dealing money laundering Arkansas days. Democracy what a farce, we destroy other nations so they can vote for their government and have a democratic society, just like America. Ha Ha Ha........Really I'm crying!!!!!
COMMENT #23 [Permalink]
said on 1/9/2008 @ 9:45 pm PT...
Hillary is da bomb--get over it.
Hillary is Bush-Lite - get used to it!
COMMENT #24 [Permalink]
Grizzly Bear Dancer
said on 1/9/2008 @ 9:46 pm PT...
Comment #15 - You want a fighter? Check out Presidential candidate Dennis Kusinich on U-tube or his website. He is a real man of the people and has different ideals and platforms than the other corp democrats who really say the same thing but vary their style. He is also the only candidate with a voting record to back it up.
The mass media has written him off by not reporting him or his stance on issues. Word up: Just because the corporate mass media doesn't want him to win, doesn't mean the American people have to fall for this line. So hard to help the helpless:(
COMMENT #25 [Permalink]
Jeannie Dean in FL-13
said on 1/9/2008 @ 10:02 pm PT...
Some of the RON PAUL supporters were starting to fund an NH RECOUNT here:
...but were just informed that in New Hampshire, only a candidate can call for a recount. Can anyone here verify that? 'Cause Fat Chance of THAT happening when they can't even wait until the fake votes are counted fakely in private before they fake concede! Even from a candidate with great integrity, it's unlikely for ANY candidate do so this early in the process.)
Great call to rally a recount/ article from them here:
The cost they're kicking around to fund a RECOUNT is 67,ooo.oo. I don't know where they got that figure, but I do believe they could do it! They've got the dough already! Seems they're FIGHTING MAD about reported and confirmed MINUS 31 vote discrepancy for RON PAUL in SUTTON, NH...
according to a poll worker, the votes weren't reported at all until today, because...
COMMENT #26 [Permalink]
John in Cincinnati
said on 1/10/2008 @ 3:04 am PT...
A big thanks for including links to Koehler's original piece.
COMMENT #27 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2008 @ 4:17 am PT...
The Battle Line is now drawn.
Corporate fascist Media vs. unsuspecting Americans, unsuspecting government employees, and others who swore an oath to defend this country.
Can't get to the FCC.
Can't legally pull their plugs.
We can complain on their public record, but that still takes time to have an effect, and we are out of time and even then if the FCC says' blagh it's ignored.
When are we going to uphold the US Constitution?
COMMENT #28 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2008 @ 7:25 am PT...
I find it amazing that no one ran a background check on these people already. We are suposed to trust these people with a part of our electoral process.
COMMENT #29 [Permalink]
said on 1/10/2008 @ 2:20 pm PT...
Posting this on all applicable threads...
This is not about Candidate A winning or Candidate B losing. This is solely about the hackable, unsecure voting machines (optical scan in NH) that have been investigated and proven to be crap and yet are still deployed to count the majority of elections in this country.
Whenever and wherever there is a discrepancy with electronic voting machines involved --- no matter how big or small the race, no matter if it's Repub or Dem --- Voting Integrity advocates look into it. It's what they do.
Please do not assume or assign motives, intentions or conclusions to anyone here that are not EXPLICITLY stated. Brad makes crystal clear that he doesn't care who won or lost, just that the results are ACCURATE. Period.
The site owner is not responsible for the opinions of commenters in this open forum. No endorsement of commenters' opinions is either intended or implied.
In addition, please note that The Brad Blog does not allege that fraud (or "rigging") has actually occurred --- only that the results of any contest that incorporates electronic voting systems should be subject to exacting scrutiny and independent verification prior to certification.
COMMENT #30 [Permalink]
JUDGE OF JUDGES
said on 1/10/2008 @ 5:55 pm PT...
Insane McCain Posse . . . . . Rides Again . . .
COMMENT #31 [Permalink]
said on 1/11/2008 @ 5:59 pm PT...
This is deep folks. We know there is no real difference between the main parties… the Clinton’s love the Bush’s for cying out loud.
OMG, did you watch the data unfold? I work with statistical data in research science, and if the margin was constant through the entire capture, we would surely have to throw out the data due to bias. obvious bias.
I felt sick to my stomach that night
I live in Iowa and felt the power of Obama’s supporters compared to all other candidates during the caucus.
Can we really achieve CHANGE?!!!
I hope to God we can. We need to summon help from the Angels with prayer…
COMMENT #32 [Permalink]
said on 1/12/2008 @ 7:24 am PT...
Thanks for posting Bob Koehler's column! He nails them as usual. I've been heartened by his writings for a long time now. It's so rare to find any journalistic integrity in the corporate press. He is a gem! I was especially impressed with his column about the 2005 election reform referendum in Ohio. All polls said the election reform initiatives would win 60/40, and, on election day, the machines turned it around into 40/60 LOSS for election reform--the biggest vote flip we've seen thus far--and early warning of what these bastards can get away with, with not a word of comment in the corporate press--except Bob Koehler, bless his truth-loving, patriotic soul!
The machines themselves (or their masters) now dictating election policy! What next?
Dennis Kucinich has asked for a recount of NH, on behalf all voters. They're going to hit him with an $80,000 cost, because he is not a top tier candidate. I just donated. I urge others to do so. It's outrageous that we have to pay for these goddamned machines, and then pay for somebody to count the goddamned votes (not to mention the cost of having the wrong goddamned people ending up in power!). And even at that cost, they don't do a full recount. With no recount, 99% to 100% of the Diebold optiscan ballots are never counted. With a recount, 97% still uncounted is the general practice (VERY inadequate audit for a 'TRADE SECRET' code system). Short of a court order ($hundreds of thousands in attorney costs), MOST of the actual ballots will never be counted.
Still, I think it will be worth the scrutiny brought to the system--if they don't fiddle the recount and sell it in the corporate news monopolies as "machines okay, move along, nothing to see here"--a distinct danger. I hope that our growing army of election integrity experts are all over this recount.
Thanks Bob and Brad, for your truth-telling! You give me hope!